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Mad at Paizo?

Parmandur

Legend
No, not really - but we live in the age of offense and outrage, so I'm not surprised someone might feel that way. Not only are you hugely exaggerating with words like "toxic" and "disgusting", but you're only harming yourself by building it up like that.

I did not say that the show "is literally disgusting" (lol, btw), nor did I say anything about any particular play style. I merely and only said that I find Critical Role off-putting, and that it makes me not want to play D&D. The rest is your hyperbolic interpretation.
If there is any hyperbole, it is in saying that the show makes you so filled with disgust that you don't want to play D&D. Frankly, I think that is is an exaggeration, but is is an offensive one. I don't care if you don't like the show, different strokes for different folks, but calling it "off-putting" is offensive.
 

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Parmandur

Legend
Streaming has had good and bad effects on the RPG hobby. But one of the bad must surely be the fostering of the kind of intensely loyal and emotional fanbases that makes the fandom of many movie and book franchises so off-putting. We have enough tribalism in this hobby already with edition warriors. Now we have people taking it personally if you don't happen to enjoy their favourite stream.
I don't care what you enjoy or don't enjoy. What is being objected to here is insulting people and their playstyle.
 

Mercurius

Legend
If there is any hyperbole, it is in saying that the show makes you so filled with disgust that you don't want to play D&D. Frankly, I think that is is an exaggeration, but is is an offensive one. I don't care if you don't like the show, different strokes for different folks, but calling it "off-putting" is offensive.
I'm hoping we both have better things to do than continue this pointless conversation, but I prefer not to be misrepresented so will correct something. I never said the show "so filled me with disgust." That is your interpretation. If I had actually said that it filled me with "disgust" (a word you've used twice), I would agree that this is hyperbolic - but given that you are the one who thinks that it fills me with disgust--even though I already said that it doesn't--clearly the hyperbole and exaggeration is yours, not mine.
 

Parmandur

Legend
I'm hoping we both have better things to do than continue this pointless conversation, but I prefer not to be misrepresented so will correct something. I never said the show "so filled me with disgust." That is your interpretation. If I had actually said that it filled me with "disgust" (a word you've used twice), I would agree that this is hyperbolic - but given that you are the only one who thinks that it fills me with disgust, clearly the hyperbole and exaggeration is solely yours, not mine.
"Off-putting" and "disgusting" are etymologically exact literal synonyms, so yes, you did say that. I notice again a distinct lack of any sort of apology for badwrongfun statements on your part, so, stay classy.
 

Mercurius

Legend
"Off-putting" and "disgusting" are etymologically exact literal synonyms, so yes, you did say that. I notice again a distinct lack of any sort of apology on your part, so, stay classy.
What should I apologize for, exactly? What did I do? I didn't insult anyone. I implied I don't like Critical Role, which is not a person.

And no, off-putting and disgusting are not the same thing. One is "warm" and the other "hot," at least as I used them. So no, I didn't say that. Again, you are making things up.
 

Parmandur

Legend
What should I apologize for, exactly? What did I do? I didn't insult anyone. I implied I don't like Critical Role, which is not a person.

And no, off-putting and disgusting are not the same thing. One is "warm" and the other "hot," at least as I used them. So no, I didn't say that. Again, you are making things up.
"disgust (n.)
1590s, "repugnance excited by something offensive or loathsome," from Middle French desgoust "strong dislike, repugnance," literally "distaste" (16c., Modern French dégoût), from desgouster "have a distaste for," from des- "opposite of" (see dis-) + gouster "taste," from Latin gustare "to taste" (from PIE root *geus- "to taste; to choose"). The literal sense, "distaste, aversion to the taste of," is from 1610s in English."

Etymologically identical. You said the show is disgusting enough to put you off of the hobby, which is insulting to anybody who has that same style or enjoys it. Badwrongfun and gatekeeping is not cool.
 


Campbell

Relaxed Intensity
There are things about the ways Matt Mercer runs Critical Role that make me wish it were not the preeminent RPG stream. However I think Matt is a great ambassador for the game.

I think when you get to the point where the ways somebody else chooses to play an RPG make you not want to play it you should take a critical look at why you feel that way. Why should how a stranger plays upset you? Do they not have the right to play the way they want to play?
 

Parmandur

Legend
There are things about the ways Matt Mercer runs Critical Role that make me wish it were not the preeminent RPG stream. However I think Matt is a great ambassador for the game.

I think when you get to the point where the ways somebody else chooses to play an RPG make you not want to play it you should take a critical look at why you feel that way. Why should how a stranger plays upset you? Do they not have the right to play the way they want to play?
Yeah, I can see why you might feel that way. It's not for everybody. A very civilized position, thank you.
 

Mercurius

Legend
There are things about the ways Matt Mercer runs Critical Role that make me wish it were not the preeminent RPG stream. However I think Matt is a great ambassador for the game.

I think when you get to the point where the ways somebody else chooses to play an RPG make you not want to play it you should take a critical look at why you feel that way. Why should how a stranger plays upset you? Do they not have the right to play the way they want to play?
My original statement was meant semi-facetiously and not at all as seriously as Parmandur took it. I don't care how Mercer or anyone plays - it doesn't upset me. I just find it unappealing, that's all. If you or others like it, more power to you.

Etymologically identical. You said the show is disgusting enough to put you off of the hobby, which is insulting to anybody who has that same style or enjoys it. Badwrongfun and gatekeeping is not cool.
This is ridiculous, Parmandur. You won't even accept my word usage and are making stuff up about how I feel. One more time: I don't feel "disgust." I don't equate "off-putting" and "disgust," in the same way I don't equate "warm" and "hot."

I said nothing about badwrongfun, gatekeeping, or how the game should or should not be played. I don't care! That is all projection on your part. I'm not sure why you're so insistent upon being offended, but I'm not really interested in being a stand-in for whatever things you're upset about. K?
 

Xenonnonex

Adventurer
My original statement was meant semi-facetiously and not at all as seriously as Parmandur took it. I don't care how Mercer or anyone plays - it doesn't upset me. I just find it unappealing, that's all. If you or others like it, more power to you.



This is ridiculous, Parmandur. You won't even accept my word usage and are making stuff up about how I feel. One more time: I don't feel "disgust." I don't equate "off-putting" and "disgust," in the same way I don't equate "warm" and "hot."

I said nothing about badwrongfun, gatekeeping, or how the game should or should not be played. I don't care! That is all projection on your part. I'm not sure why you're so insistent upon being offended, but I'm not really interested in being a stand-in for whatever things you're upset about. K?
But if it makes you not want to play D&D do you not feel a measure of disgust?
 

Parmandur

Legend
My original statement was meant semi-facetiously and not at all as seriously as Parmandur took it. I don't care how Mercer or anyone plays - it doesn't upset me. I just find it unappealing, that's all. If you or others like it, more power to you.



This is ridiculous, Parmandur. You won't even accept my word usage and are making stuff up about how I feel. One more time: I don't feel "disgust." I don't equate "off-putting" and "disgust," in the same way I don't equate "warm" and "hot."

I said nothing about badwrongfun, gatekeeping, or how the game should or should not be played. I don't care! That is all projection on your part. I'm not sure why you're so insistent upon being offended, but I'm not really interested in being a stand-in for whatever things you're upset about. K?
I accept the usage of the English language: you are entitle to your own opinions, and you own taste, but not your own definition of word. Facetious statements can be very aggressive and hurtful, and are not appropriate in certain contexts.
 


Mercurius

Legend
But if it makes you not want to play D&D do you not feel a measure of disgust?
No. Disgust is too strong of a word. I didn't even use "off-putting" in the original statement, just as explanation. It is more accurate than disgust. Or distaste, if you prefer.
 

Parmandur

Legend
No. Disgust is too strong of a word. I didn't even use "off-putting" in the original statement, just as explanation. It is more accurate than disgust. Or distaste, if you prefer.
Yet it is not too strong a word for what your words communicated. If it was a joke, it was hurtful.
 




GaiusMarius

Villager
I mean between Critical Role (right now) and their Pathfinder equivalent (can't remember nor find their names)
Not sure what exact podcast/stream you mean but probably Glass Cannon?

Of the two, I prefer GC a lot more. I've listened to some episodes of Critical role and it just never clicked with me at all, not really a systems issue or acting issue either just a 'Meh, i've given it two episodes and its still not really clear to me which voice belongs to which character.'
 

Umbran

Mod Squad
Staff member
"Off-putting" and "disgusting" are etymologically exact literal synonyms, so yes, you did say that.

No.

If you are not prepared to allow for differences in connotation, you probably aren't in a place to have a constructive discussion on the internet. Restating an opponent's position using more severe language and then claiming they did something wrong is a technique older than the internet, but it is pretty easy to spot.

Please don't do this. Thanks.
 

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