Mage Knight Class, Please Help Balance, Spell List Added

[Sravoff]

My apologies for the screwed up table but my browser won't let it wotk right. I got it pretty close though.....
Now before any one criticizes too bad on a couple things there are a few things that still need tweaking, which is why I appealed to you all here for help.

1st: I need some more skills for this guy, he doesn't have much and needs some more.
2nd: Melee mounted combat style is much weaker than archery, that needs tweaking.
3rd: I know Ride and cast doesn't doo much at higher levels, ranks in concentration will almost alway out do rie and cast. It is there mainly for flavor.

That being said dig in and help/butcher/critisize/ignore how you see fit!

Mage Knight
HD: d8
Skl: 4+int mod
Skls: Concentration, Handle Animal, Knowledge Arcana, Ride, Spellcraft,
Craft, Profession, Knowledge (Nobility/royalty)
Base Attack Bonus is average (like Cleric)
Saves: Good is Will and Fortitude, Poor is Reflex

WEAPONS AND ARMOR
Mage Knights are proficient with all simple weapons and the short,and long sword, the short bow, the battleaxe, the hand axe, light hammer, Warhammer, lance, and scimitar. Mage Knights are proficient with no armor but are proficient with light shields.

IGNORE SHIELD FAILURE
While using a shield the mage Knight is proficient with the arcane spell failure chance does not apply. This has no effect when using a shield the knight does not have proficieny or when using armor. This abiity is post if the Mage Knight ears any armor.

MOUNTED STYLE
At second level the mage knight chooses a mounted combat style to pursue. If he chooses Archery he gains mounted archery as a bonus feat even if he doesn't have the prerequisites. If she chooses Melee she gains the Ride-by-Attack feat even if she doesn't meet the prerequisites.
At 6th level if she cose archery she gains point blank shot as a bonusfeat even if she doesn't meet the prerequisites. If he chose melee he gains spirited charge even if he doesn't meet the prerequisites.
At 11th level if she chose archery she gains prescise shot as a bonus feat even if she doesn't meet the prerequisites. If he chose melee he gains Trample as a bonus feat.

RIDE AND CAST
As a mage knight gains experience at casting from a saddle he gets better at oncentrating while in the saddle. He gains this bonus to his concetration check whenever casting a spell from a moving mount.

BONUS FEAT
At fifth level and every four levels after that the mage knight gets a bonus feat from the following list
Animal Affinity, Combat Casting, Power Attack, Weapon focus, Toughness, (greater) Spell Focus, Quickdraw, Widen Spell, maximize spell, Still Spell, Extend Spell, and any other your DM allows. (Complete arcan comes to mind but I don't have the book on me.)

SPELLS
Spells, Mage knights cast spells from a small pool of known spell, similar to a sorcerer. Either Type 1 or 2. I haven't yet decided.

level  Spells Per day		 Spells Known	Special
..1 | 3/1		 | 3/2			 | Mounted Combat, Ignore shield failure
..2 | 4/2		 | 3/2		 	 | Mounted Style
..3 | 4/2/1		 | 4/3/1			 |
..4 | 4/3/2		 | 4/3/2			 | Ride and Cast +1 
..5 | 4/3/2/1		 | 5/4/2/1		 | Bonus Feat
..6 | 4/3/3/2		 | 5/4/3/2		 | Improved Mounted Style
..7 | 4/4/3/2/1		  | 6/4/3/2/1		   |
..8 | 4/4/3/3/2		 | 6/4/4/3/2		 | Ride and Cast +2
..9 | 4/4/4/3/2/1	  | 7/4/4/3/2/1		   | Bonus Feat
.10 | 4/4/4/3/3/2	  | 7/4/4/3/3/2		   |
.11 | 4/4/4/4/3/2/1	  | 7/4/4/3/3/2/1	   | Mounted Style Mastery
.12 | 4/4/4/4/3/3/2	  | 7/4/4/3/3/3/2	   | Ride and Cast +3
.13 | 4/4/4/4/4/3/2/1	  | 7/4/4/3/3/3/2/1	   | Bonus Feat
 14 | 4/4/4/4/4/3/3/2 	  | 7/4/4/3/3/3/2/2	   |
 15 | 4/4/4/4/4/4/3/2/1   | 7/4/4/3/3/3/2/2/1	   | 
 16 | 4/4/4/4/4/4/3/3/2   | 7/4/4/3/3/3/2/2/2	   | Ride and Cast +4
 17 | 4/4/4/4/4/4/4/3/2/1 | 7/4/4/3/3/3/2/2/2/1	   | Bonus Feat
 18 | 4/4/4/4/4/4/4/3/3/2 | 7/4/4/3/3/3/2/2/2/2	   |
 19 | 4/4/4/4/4/4/4/4/3/3 | 7/4/4/3/3/3/2/2/2/2    |
 20 | 4/4/4/4/4/4/4/4/4/4 | 7/4/4/3/3/3/2/2/2/2   | Ride and Cast +5

 

[DanMcS]

Mage Knight
HD: d8
Skl: 4+int mod
Skls: Concentration, Handle Animal, Knowledge Arcana, Ride, Spellcraft,
Craft, Profession, Knowledge (Nobility/royalty)
Base Attack Bonus is average (like Cleric)
Saves: Good is Will and Fortitude, Poor is Reflex

WEAPONS AND ARMOR
Mage Knights are proficient with all simple weapons and the short,and long sword, the short bow, the battleaxe, the hand axe, light hammer, Warhammer, lance, and scimitar. Mage Knights are proficient with no armor but are proficient with light shields.

At this point, this guy is looking better than a cleric, and cleric is one of the strongest classes in 3.5. Definitely way better than a sorceror (gets 2nd level and higher spells 1 level earlier, for one). Should probably be 2+int mod skill points/level, and either a d6 hit points, or drop one of the good saves to poor.

Actually, I would recommend either giving this guy a slower, bard-like casting progression that maxes out at 6th level spells; bard is a good model for a half-caster.

Or else make him a full caster, giving him a more sorceror-like spell progression and then dropping his hit die and one of his good saves to poor.

 

[Sravoff]

HHmmm.... Okay half caster sounds good, though he will need an alternate spell list. I'll work on it. Gald you mentioned Bard, perfect progression.

Changes:
2+in mod for skills
Lowered Spellcasting ability (Casting ability is equal to bard though has an alternate spell list.)

Thanks!

-Sravoff

 

[DanMcS]

HHmmm.... Okay half caster sounds good, though he will need an alternate spell list. I'll work on it. Gald you mentioned Bard, perfect progression.

Changes:
2+in mod for skills
Lowered Spellcasting ability (Casting ability is equal to bard though has an alternate spell list.)

Just use the wizard/sorceror spell list, it should be fine.

 

[Sravoff]

How does this look for a spell list? The spell in parenthase for level six are level seven spell I think the Mage knight should get.

MAGE KNIGHT SPELL LIST
0th
Resistance, Acid Splash, Daze, Flare, Light, Ray of Frost, Disrupt undead, Arcaen Mark,

1st
Shield, Mage Armor, Grease, Summon Monster I, Mount, Obscurring Mist, True Strike, Sleep, Magic Missle, Silent Image, Cause Fear, Ray of Enfeeblement, Enlarge Person, Magic Weapon, Reduce Person,

2nd
Protectoin from Arrows, Resist Energy, Fog Cloud, Melf's Acid Arrow, Summon Monster II,
Summon Swarm, See Invisibiilty, Daze Monster, Tasha's Laughter, Flaming Sphere, Scorching Ray, Blur, Minor Image, Mirror Image, False Life, Scare, Bear's Endurance, Bull's Strength, Darvision, Rope Trick

3rd
Dispel Magic, Absorb Energy, Phantom Steed, Sleet Storm, Summon Monster III, Deep Slumber, Heroism, Rage, Fireball, Lightning bolt, Dsiplacement, Invisibilty Sphere, Major Image, Ray of Exhastion, Blink, Flame Arrow, Fly, Haste, Keen Edge, Magic Weapon Greater, Slow

4th
Globe Of Invulnerability, Stone Skin, Evards Black Tentacles, Solid Fog, Sumon Monster IV, Crushing Despair, Fire Shield, Ice Storm, Otilukes Resilient Sphere, Wall Of fire, Wall of Ice, Invisibility Greater, Phantasmal Killer, Bestow Curse, Fear, Enlarge Person Mass, Reduce Person Mass,

5th
Cloud Kill, Summon Monster V, Wall of Stone, Prying Eyes, Hold Monster, Mind Fog, Cone of Cold, Wall of Force, Baleful Polymorph, Transmute rock to mud, Transmute mud to rock

6th
Antimagic field, Dispel MAgic Greater, Globe of Invulnerability, Acid Fog, Summon Monster VI, Wall of Iron, Heroism, Greater, Chain Lightning, Otiluke's Freezing Sphere, Circle of Death, Bear's and Bull's Strength Mass, Disinigrate, Stone to flesh, flesh to stone, tensers transformation, (Otilukes resilient Sphere, Invisibility mass Greater

 

[Sravoff]

HHmmm.......... Bard gets two good saves, 3/4 bab, d6 hd, bard spells, bardic music and 6 skill points.
Mage knight gets two good saves, 3/4 bab, d8 hd, bard spells, bonus feats and mounted combat, and 4 skill.

So they are rather even except for:
Skills-Bard 6, Mage Knight 4
Special-Bard bardic music, Mage Knight feats and combat style.
HitD0Bard d6, Mage Knight d8

Okay those bonus feats do add quite a bit.

Mage Knight 2 skill points. And the Alternate Spell list?
I don't want it to have all the spells there because quite a few of them jst aren't right for flavor. The Mage Knight should be a general and a leader, leadering her men through cunning arcane and cunning mundane. Still not happy about the lower skill points. Perhaps drop extra feats and give more of a leadership bonus.........

Thanks

-Sravoff

 

[tjoneslo]

From the Class Construction Guide.

Hit Dice d8 (40), 4 skill points per level (20), 8 class skills (4), Moderate BAB (45), two good saves (30), shield proficient (2), all simple weapons and 9 others (14.5), Ignore sheild failure (2), Mounted Style (6), Ride and cast (4), four bonus feats (8), Arcane Casting (24). Total 199.5.

This is low compared to the other base classes.

This class seems to be focused upon being a mage who can also ride and weild a sword (rather than the other way round), based upon the abilities and spell list. I would make the following suggestions: add bluff and sense motive to the skill list, simply for their use in combat.

If you want more of the leadership role for this class, absolutely add the leadership feat and bonuses to the class. I also might borrow the Bard's inspriation ability, not via singing but by speech making, allow giving morale bonuses to the characters cohorts.

 

[IcyCool]

In all honesty, I think you could accomplish what you are shooting for using a Bard with the following changes:

1. Swap Bardic Knowledge out for your bonus feats.
2. Change Bardic Music to use Perform[Oratory] and call it Inspirational Speech (or somesuch), drop all the bardic music abilities except the inspires.
3. Drop some skills from the Bard list, and add Ride and Cast.
4. Grant the Mage Knight an animal companion as a ranger.

A couple of things to think about.

1. You want your Mage Knight to be able to ride and cast spells, but you are filling up both his hands (shield and weapon, or two handed weapon). This means that most of the time, the Mage Knight won't be able to cast any spells with a somatic component (requires one free hand).

2. Try to avoid the d8 Hit Die arcane caster. Max it at d6 and pump with special abilities.

 

[Kisanji Arael]

It seems rather weak to me. There's almost no reason to continue past 17th level, and in addition, the ride and cast ability seems rather weak in general. Maybe you should make it a bonus to more than just concentration. Perhaps give them a mount at some level, though more like a familiar than a Paladin's Warhorse. And later, you could have it upgrade to a flying beast. But as things are, the Wizard gains more from his flexibility options.

 

[Sravoff]

Valuable comments.

tjoneslo: Excelent Ideas and I definitly will implement them. They gain leadership at 6th level and no bonus feat at fifth. I will look into the inspire ability and probably add it some where around fourth. I don't have My books right now but I will look into it. Those skills will definitly added.

IcyCool: I was thinking that the Mage Knight could cast spells while using a one handed weapon and a light shield. Also that they could cast spells one handed while using a lance. I probably should have added that. About the D6 HD, I see what you mean though I am not sure what abilities to add. Perhaps the changes I have added would justify a dropped HD, not sure. I will thin on this....

Kisanji: I see what you mean. You gain a few extra spells per day and get an ability that isn't needed. A 17th level Mage Knight and a 3rd level Fighter would be a better choice. I ned to add more past that. I must Ponder.....

Thank you all for the comments, I'll get my books back in a couple days. So I will post changes then. Until then thanks for the input.

-Sravoff