Mando season 3

[Hussar]

The Emperor was able to take power because he offered an alternative to the corrupt and inefficient bureacracy of the Republic. And he wasn't wrong. The Empire didn't really last very long, and as soon as the Rebellion brought down the Emperor, the corrupt and inefficient Republic bureacracy reasserted itself.

That's actually one of my frustrations with the Star Wars universe, it seems to bounce back and forth between authoritarianism and corrupt bureacratic democracy with very little in-between. It's only those "rebels" who work outside the system who are the heroes.

Welcome to American fiction.

 

[Dire Bare]

Welcome to American fiction.

Please.

Bad tropes exist in fiction from all cultures, American, British, and everyone else too. And there is plenty of American fiction that doesn't rely on repeating bad tropes.

And of course, the existence of bad tropes doesn't necessarily mean the fiction itself is bad . . . I hear a lot of folks LOVE Star Wars, for example.

 

[Dire Bare]

Think in a lot of ways Disney just repeats Lucas work. Republic fell overnight Empire lasted a year after Endor.

This was an issue with Star Wars long before Disney took over the franchise.

Pick almost any point in Star Wars history (in-universe or meta), spanning millennia . . . and you'll find something very close to rebels fighting against an evil empire or rebels fighting from within a corrupt and inefficient democratic bureaucracy. Or both.

 

[Zardnaar]

This was an issue with Star Wars long before Disney took over the franchise.

Pick almost any point in Star Wars history (in-universe or meta), spanning millennia . . . and you'll find something very close to rebels fighting against an evil empire or rebels fighting from within a corrupt and inefficient democratic bureaucracy. Or both.

Yup you beed sone sort of threat to the government in charge.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Pick almost any point in Star Wars history (in-universe or meta), spanning millennia . . . and you'll find something very close to rebels fighting against an evil empire or rebels fighting from within a corrupt and inefficient democratic bureaucracy. Or both.

This doesn't really hold up to scrutiny if you're a serious Star Wars nerd, I would suggest. It's certainly not true re: "spanning millennia".

The problematic bit is "rebels fighting from within a corrupt and inefficient democratic bureaucracy", which isn't a major theme in Star Wars at all (quite the contrary), and is so entirely vague as potentially cover everything from a senator disagreeing with a policy to actual rebel insurgents running a terrorist campaign against a genuinely oppressive government.

It's also not true in the current post-Disney EU.

In the post-Disney EU, most eras simply don't have any detail, so you definitely couldn't call it either way as to whether either of the two situations was occurring (though again, the second one is so broad it's arguably always going on in all democratic societies - like I could argue it was true at literally all points of US history post-Revolutionary War, though I wouldn't want to because some of the people you'd have to argue for are pretty gross!). Even in the pre-Disney EU, most of the 4000 years between the Old Republic (where neither condition was meaningfully true, note!) and the Battle of Yavin was just a blank slate and we couldn't say either way. Indeed it would be safest to assume neither was happening, logically.

In the new, post-Disney EU, we only have significant detail on one period outside that of the decades around the Battle of Yavin, and that is the High Republic period, which is like 100 years before that. And in that period we definitely don't have either an evil empire, or a corrupt bureaucracy. The High Republic bureaucracy is somewhat inefficient and slow to react, but that's because it's democratic in a more genuine way that a lot of Western countries, especially the US, and is governing much of an entire galaxy. But it isn't meaningfully or significantly corrupt - and they actually make a point of this in the High Republic books. Rather the big challenge it faces is simply trying to govern such a vast super-nation full of diverse peoples. It actively tries to avoid being oppressive, which doesn't make that easier. And when I say slow to react, they do manage deploy stuff to save people within hours of a threat, more than once, and actually cause pretty huge problems for their adversaries (mostly a vast pirate fleet, which is definitely not fascist/imperial, rather more like an evil version of anarcho-syndicalism), but they're not great at anticipating threats and getting ahead of problems (partly due to overreliance on the Jedi, I would suggest).

 

[Zardnaar]

This doesn't really hold up to scrutiny if you're a serious Star Wars nerd, I would suggest. It's certainly not true re: "spanning millennia".

The problematic bit is "rebels fighting from within a corrupt and inefficient democratic bureaucracy", which isn't a major theme in Star Wars at all (quite the contrary), and is so entirely vague as potentially cover everything from a senator disagreeing with a policy to actual rebel insurgents running a terrorist campaign against a genuinely oppressive government.

It's also not true in the current post-Disney EU.

In the post-Disney EU, most eras simply don't have any detail, so you definitely couldn't call it either way as to whether either of the two situations was occurring (though again, the second one is so broad it's arguably always going on in all democratic societies - like I could argue it was true at literally all points of US history post-Revolutionary War, though I wouldn't want to because some of the people you'd have to argue for are pretty gross!). Even in the pre-Disney EU, most of the 4000 years between the Old Republic (where neither condition was meaningfully true, note!) and the Battle of Yavin was just a blank slate and we couldn't say either way. Indeed it would be safest to assume neither was happening, logically.

In the new, post-Disney EU, we only have significant detail on one period outside that of the decades around the Battle of Yavin, and that is the High Republic period, which is like 100 years before that. And in that period we definitely don't have either an evil empire, or a corrupt bureaucracy. The High Republic bureaucracy is somewhat inefficient and slow to react, but that's because it's democratic in a more genuine way that a lot of Western countries, especially the US, and is governing much of an entire galaxy. But it isn't meaningfully or significantly corrupt - and they actually make a point of this in the High Republic books. Rather the big challenge it faces is simply trying to govern such a vast super-nation full of diverse peoples. It actively tries to avoid being oppressive, which doesn't make that easier. And when I say slow to react, they do manage deploy stuff to save people within hours of a threat, more than once, and actually cause pretty huge problems for their adversaries (mostly a vast pirate fleet, which is definitely not fascist/imperial, rather more like an evil version of anarcho-syndicalism), but they're not great at anticipating threats and getting ahead of problems (partly due to overreliance on the Jedi, I would suggest).

It's basically rebels/republic vs an empire or Sith Vs Republic.

Disney's just keeping up tradition.

 

[Hussar]

Please.

Bad tropes exist in fiction from all cultures, American, British, and everyone else too. And there is plenty of American fiction that doesn't rely on repeating bad tropes.

And of course, the existence of bad tropes doesn't necessarily mean the fiction itself is bad . . . I hear a lot of folks LOVE Star Wars, for example.

It's not really a "bad" trope. But, the individual vs the state is a pretty strong theme in most American literature. The idea that any group authority is automatically corrupt or authoritarian is a very common theme.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Could they not afford enough extras to make the city have an actual population?

It would depend on where they filmed the sequence. One of the reasons movies film in the UK, for example, is you can generally get lots of people to volunteer as extras just for the fun of it. But that wasn't the UK!

 

[MarkB]

It would depend on where they filmed the sequence. One of the reasons movies film in the UK, for example, is you can generally get lots of people to volunteer as extras just for the fun of it. But that wasn't the UK!

The limiting factor may have been how many people they could stuff into the Volume.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

It's basically rebels/republic vs an empire or Sith Vs Republic.

My point is that it's not, illustrated with a genuine and up to date example lol.