MCDM starts work on its RPG Monday!

Reynard

Legend
Agreed. Looking at the discussion of the Genesys/Star Wars dice, you could easily replicate that with standard dice. The percentages would be off, but you could easily roll a few standard dice and map that to each of the axes presented. This die is success/fail. That die is advantage/threat. Etc.
The book tells you what faces on "normal dice" mean what. It isn't difficult or secret.
 

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overgeeked

B/X Known World
The book tells you what faces on "normal dice" mean what. It isn't difficult or secret.
No. I mean you could use say a d8 for success/fail. A d6 for advantage/threat. And 2d4 for triumph/threat. As long as the d4 are different colors, you’d know at a glance what the result is without the translating to and from hieroglyphics.

Over the Edge 3rd Edition does the first two axes with only 2d6.
 

DMZ2112

Chaotic Looseleaf
What a thoroughly arbitrary distinction.
Oh, don't give me that. Objects have relative value. That isn't a surprise to anyone. Specialty dice are not a requirement of any system -- you even acknowledge that, just below.
You can use regular dice with Genesys, and YZE, and even Fate. You just have to think a little.
You have to use a paper success matrix, is what you have to do. (EDIT: Okay, not for FATE, but FATE dice are just custom d3s.)
Is this like that "military intelligence" joke?
Also also yes.
 

Reynard

Legend
No. I mean you could use say a d8 for success/fail. A d6 for advantage/threat. And 2d4 for triumph/threat. As long as the d4 are different colors, you’d know at a glance what the result is without the translating to and from hieroglyphics.
Oh, I see. I thought you were still specifically talking about Genesys dice.

Yeah, I have always liked the "handful of dice" approach. I actually rather like the Year Zero Engine approach, where they are all d6, but your stat dice versus your skill dice versus your gear dice have different success rates and extra effects.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
Oh, I see. I thought you were still specifically talking about Genesys dice.
More trying to roughly replicate the complex result without the specialty dice. Only point being is that you can design complex resolution mechanics with multiple axes that yield varied results without the use of custom dice.
 

overgeeked

B/X Known World
As an example...

Success/failure. Roll 1d10, succeed on a 5+.

Advantage/threat. Roll 1d6-1d6. A positive result is Advantage; a negative result is Threat.

Triumph. Roll 1d4-1. A non-zero result is counted as Triumph.

Disaster. Roll 1d4-1. A non-zero result is counted as Disaster.

A dice pool system with five normal dice. Chances are good if you're on this site you already have enough dice to use this system. I literally have the dice to do this sitting on my desk. As long as the d6s and d4s are different colors, you can make one roll and know without much work the same things you could with several sets of custom dice that you'll have to learn the symbols for and translate into a result.

I really hope Matt's team talks him down from specialty dice. But, even if they don't, I'll still check it out.
 

Reynard

Legend
As an example...

Success/failure. Roll 1d10, succeed on a 5+.

Advantage/threat. Roll 1d6-1d6. A positive result is Advantage; a negative result is Threat.

Triumph. Roll 1d4-1. A non-zero result is counted as Triumph.

Disaster. Roll 1d4-1. A non-zero result is counted as Disaster.

A dice pool system with five normal dice. Chances are good if you're on this site you already have enough dice to use this system. I literally have the dice to do this sitting on my desk. As long as the d6s and d4s are different colors, you can make one roll and know without much work the same things you could with several sets of custom dice that you'll have to learn the symbols for and translate into a result.

I really hope Matt's team talks him down from specialty dice. But, even if they don't, I'll still check it out.
And people think THAC0 is hard... ;)
 



overgeeked

B/X Known World
I actually think weird dice are easy to use because the symbols actually mean something in and of themselves. But quick arithmetic isn't hard either.
Can be. But they are an added barrier to entry. Especially if those symbols are unique to this game. Because the user has to learn them and translate them to and from game speak into regular use. I can learn, over time, what the little triangles and bursts mean on those Star Wars dice...but they are new information that I have to parse. And they will continue to be a hindrance to play until I've sufficiently mastered translating to and from those symbols. Basic math is something everyone should have learned in school. If that's too hard, then the dozen or so esoteric symbols that yeild 20+ unique results of the Star Wars dice should be equally out of reach. Translating those results to a single chart, say a d20 chart would still be easier. My only point being there are a lot of easier and less expensive ways to achieve the same (or similar) results. I get why companies want to have unique peripherals (so they can make more money), but then we're just back into the whole problem of pushing bad design to make money. But then I'm a big fan of simpler is better.
 





Staffan

Legend
Still easier that whatever the hell those symbols are on those weird dice.
I mean, I started a new Age of Rebellion campaign last Saturday, with one player who hadn't played Star Wars before. I did not note that player have any problem with the mechanic.

It helps that the dice are color-coded as well. You know that any symbol on a blue/green/yellow die is a success, an advantage, or (yellow only) a triumph. Same with the black/purple/red dice.
 


overgeeked

B/X Known World
I mean, I started a new Age of Rebellion campaign last Saturday, with one player who hadn't played Star Wars before. I did not note that player have any problem with the mechanic.

It helps that the dice are color-coded as well. You know that any symbol on a blue/green/yellow die is a success, an advantage, or (yellow only) a triumph. Same with the black/purple/red dice.
Sure. At a guess the players knew ahead of time they'd be playing that game. So unless you surprised them with it they had time to read up on the funky dice.
 



overgeeked

B/X Known World
Okay. Of course, THAC0 IS absolutely basic math.
THAC0 - (die roll + bonus) = AC hit
You left out the chart of numbers you have to reference.

So you're saying that:

n1 - (n2 + n3) = n4

is easier than:

n1 - n2

Okay. Sure. Twice as many steps is clearly easier for some reason.

Clearly this whole WotC nuking the OGL thing can't take the gamer out of gamers. We'll literally argue about anything if given the time.

I'm out.
 

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