MnM3 Centropolis (Re-bot)

[GreenKarl]

There are not really 'mecha' rules in standard M&M... I think they have a supplement that uses them in gene but I don't have them (as I was never interested personally). Are you building it with Equipment points? Ah then sorry no, because its is WAY more advance then something you can normally purchased. Yes this is a supers game and there is super science, but it does not work like that for vehicles.

At least not if you want to balance them against other characters. Its basically a REAL cheap way to purchase powers then. Look at 'Enhanced Equipment' on page. 159

 

[Zerith]

http://www.d20herosrd.com/7-gadgets-gear/mecha/
Also, not only can Felix be deprived of it, but it makes little sense for him to simply have it on hand when out and about. Even in the base it would take him turns to get to it, much less get two it and back. we are talking about a car sized suit: if someone ambushes him and he did not make sure it would be ready and on hand, he dos not have it. Without it, Felix is just a healer who is nearly defenseless. It also disables his own powers by large.

It also suffers vehicle rules, that I'm still reading up on: such as if it takes damage then it gets weaker.
That said I could remake Felix as a suit user, if you guys like
I should hit refresh and read once more before I post Anything :/

alright then, I'll remake him as a suit user with a magic theme.

 

[GreenKarl]

Ah sure but I don't really want to start changing and adding rules outside the basic book because we never talked about it and I never approved of anything but the base rules. I want everyone to be 'balanced' out as best we can (balance is all relative of course and you can build really unbalanced character with the base rules).

Yes it would suffer just like a vehicle, etc. but I am still not convinced its balanced enough. If you want a vehicle to get from point-a-to-point-b, cool. Even if it has a few powers with it, that is totally cool. If you want a vehicle that is basically a super-hero, sorry, got to build it some other way.

Yes I would prefer if you purchased it as a Battlesuit. You could also build him with some Alt. Powers from the basic Armored suit to reflex Felix outside the suit (these powers would be at the lower point value for the Device limitation, but not have them for example). So like your Healing Power might be the Protection and Impervious Power alt, and your Growth & Density powers might have the alt of Enhanced Dodge and Parry.

 

[Zerith]

and now my edit got sniped XD
I can work with that. My timing today... Zesh.

 

[GreenKarl]

No problem, thanks

 

[Zerith]

Broke the suit into 4 parts to keep things a lil more clear, don't recall if I was suppose to total all powers tied to the item before reducing the cost by 1/5 or not, so for now not doing that and rounding up.

Anyways, comments?

[sblock=Felix]PL 9 (Power Points 135)
Base
STR -2 STA 2 AGL 6 DEX 5 FGT 6 INT 10 AWE -3 PRE 3
Out of suit
STR -2 STA 2 AGL 10 DEX 7 FGT 6 INT 10 AWE -3 PRE 3
In Suit
STR 8 STA 12 AGL 6 DEX 5 FGT 6 INT 10 AWE -3 PRE 3
Powers:

Suit
Growth 6 7(8)pp
-Permanent, Innate, removable
Alt-Enhanced Dexterity 2 (4pp)

Density4 5(6)pp
-Permanent, Innate, removable
Alt-Healing 9 (2pp)
[Limited to others, Emphatic, Distracting, Activation(Movement)]

Impervious11 10(12)pp
-removable
Alt-Regen 5

Magic Array 12(14)pp
-Magic Eldritch Blast 9
--Blast 2, Distracting, Side effect(center on user), Skill Magic Role 16+ Removable
-Create, Force Wall 3
--Distracting, Stationary, Tether, Movable, Selective, Impervious, Removable
Alt-Enhanced Agility 4 (8pp)

Ground speed 3 3pp (effective rank 4 in suit)
Quickness 2 2pp
Quickness 3 1pp
-mental only, distracting
Quickness 8 2pp
-reading only, distracting
Improved Initiative 5 5pp
Jumping 2 2pp
1 Extra Limbs 2pp
-Innate
Senses Acute Smell, Tracking Smell, Low-Light, Ultra-Hearing 5pp


Advantages: Wealth 2, Improved Grab*, Interpose, Hide in plain Sight, Eidetic Memory.


Skills: Expertise: Acrobatics 2 (+12), Athletics7 (+5), Computers 2 (+12), Expertise: Art 1 (+11), Stealth 5 (+15), Expertise: Magic 4 (+14), Treatment 1 (+11), Technology 5 (+15), Vehicles 1 (+8)
Suit Skill Totals: Expertise: Acrobatics 2 (+8), Athletics7 (+19), Computers 2 (+12), Expertise: Art 1 (+11), Stealth 5 (+1), Expertise: Magic 4 (+14), Treatment 1 (+11), Technology 5 (+15), Vehicles 1 (+6)

Offense: Initiative +30 , Unarmed +6 (Close, Damage -2)
Suit Offense: Initiative +26 , Unarmed +6 (Close, Damage 8)

Defense: Dodge 20 (+10), Parry 16 (+6), Fortitude +2, Toughness +2, Will 2(5pp)
Suit Defense: Dodge 11 (+1), Parry 11 (+1), Fortitude +12, Toughness +12, Will 2(5pp)

Totals: Abilities 60 + Powers 51 + Advantages 5 + Skills 14 + Defense 5 = 135[/sblock]

Dex Error with bass (base is 5 ^_^ fixed lowered Computer to 2 to fix point over spend

 

[Shayuri]

Alright, I feel like there's a lot I'm missing or not getting here, so I want to go step by step.

Base
STR -2 STA 2 AGL 6 DEX 7 FGT 6 INT 10 AWE -3 PRE 3

Okay, so...I'm fuzzy on the difference between 'base' and 'out of suit.' He's either in the suit and uses his suit stats, or he's not in the suit and he's using the out of suit stats, right? When would 'base' attributes apply? Or do you mean that these are the attributes you paid for with Attribute points, and the other two are modified by super powers?

Out of suit
STR -2 STA 2 AGL 10 DEX 7 FGT 6 INT 10 AWE -3 PRE 3

Nothing wrong ruleswise with this, but it's a pretty wiggy set of stats. He's about as strong as a child, catastrophically oblivious, but possesses incredible superhuman speed and reflexes and intelligence. I'm very curious to see his description and background now.

In Suit
STR 8 STA 12 AGL 6 DEX 5 FGT 6 INT 10 AWE -3 PRE 3

So the suit slows him down but strengthens him and toughens him up. Seems legit. With a dodge of 1, you're actually well below PL in defenses, but I'll assume that's what you had in mind.

Powers:

Suit
Growth 6 7(8)pp
-Permanent, Innate, removable
Alt-Enhanced Dexterity 2 (4pp)

So, I feel like it's a bit weird to have the 'alt' powers listed under 'suit.' They're the powers that specifically apply only when NOT wearing the suit, right? By the same token, the alt powers shouldn't benefit from the Removable limit? They can't be taken away from you without your consent. The suit can be stolen, but your enhanced speed and dexterity cannot be. This applies to other 'alt-suit' powers you have listed as well.

Density4 5(6)pp
-Permanent, Innate, removable
Alt-Healing 9 (2pp)
[Limited to others, Emphatic, Distracting, Activation(Movement)]

Impervious11 10(12)pp
-removable
Alt-Regen 5

Magic Array 12(14)pp
-Magic Eldritch Blast 9
--Blast 2, Distracting, Side effect(center on user), Skill Magic Role 16+ Removable

So...just to be clear. This is a magic item (it's removable) that causes a powerful detonation affecting everyone within 60' of you, including yourself, that activates with a skill check. Is that what you want it to be? This also seems to be your only attack? Oh, also, you can't take 'user at center' as a side effect. You bought an Area damage power with no Range. It is centered on you by default.

-Create, Force Wall 3
--Distracting, Stationary, Tether, Movable, Selective, Impervious, Removable
Alt-Enhanced Agility 4 (8pp)

Create can't have an 'alt power.' It's already in an array. Just pay another point and add Enhanced Agility to the array.

Ground speed 3 3pp (effective rank 4 in suit)

I see what you're doing here, but it's a confusing way to write it. It'd be better to write '+1 Speed' under the suit powers, and have +3 Speed here under the powers you always have access to.

Quickness 2 2pp
Quickness 3 1pp
-mental only, distracting

This makes it look like you have 5 ranks in Quickness, 3 of which are for mental only tasks and are distracting. I think what you MEAN to have is 3 ranks in Quickness, 1 of which is mental only and distracting.

Quickness 8 2pp
-reading only, distracting

GM call, but I dunno if 'distracting' is redundant with reading, since reading would probably generally be considered a distraction regardless?

Improved Initiative 5 5pp
Jumping 2 2pp
1 Extra Limbs 2pp
-Innate
Senses Acute Smell, Tracking Smell, Low-Light, Ultra-Hearing 5pp


Advantages: Wealth 2, Improved Grab*, Interpose, Hide in plain Sight, Eidetic Memory.

What's the asterisk for? Just curious.

Skills: Expertise: Acrobatics 2 (+12), Athletics7 (+5), Computers 3 (+13), Expertise: Art 1 (+11), Stealth 5 (+15), Expertise: Magic 4 (+14), Treatment 1 (+11), Technology 5 (+15), Vehicles 1 (+8)

Suit Skill Totals: Expertise: Acrobatics 2 (+8), Athletics7 (+19), Computers 3 (+13), Expertise: Art 1 (+11), Stealth 5 (+1), Expertise: Magic 4 (+14), Treatment 1 (+11), Technology 5 (+15), Vehicles 1 (+6)

Offense: Initiative +30 , Unarmed +6 (Close, Damage -2)
Suit Offense: Initiative +26 , Unarmed +6 (Close, Damage 8)

Defense: Dodge 20 (+10), Parry 16 (+6), Fortitude +2, Toughness +2, Will 2(5pp)
Suit Defense: Dodge 11 (+1), Parry 11 (+1), Fortitude +12, Toughness +12, Will 2(5pp)

So it bears a mention; your defenses are out of whack to the point I'm afraid it may cause you frustration. Your battlesuit has great Toughness to be sure, but with Dodge and Parry of 1, a number of foes will be able to trade accuracy for hitting power (with an Advantage)...and with Will 2, you'll be incredibly vulnerable to mental powers as well. Conversely, in speedster form, out of your suit, your Dodge is good, but not INCREDIBLY good, and your Toughness is paper thin. 10 Dodge is not -that- hard to hit, and with just +2 toughness, you could easily be put down in one or two hits.

If that's what you want, that's fine. It's perfectly legal. I just want to mention it to be sure you're aware of the ramifications of these choices.

Totals: Abilities 60 + Powers 51 + Advantages 5 + Skills 14 + Defense 5 = 135

You've spent 29 skill points by my count (2+7+3+1+5+4+1+5+1), which means you either have 15cp in skills and have a skill point left...or you need to drop a skill point to hit 14cp.

 

[Zerith]

Now THAT is the kind of comments I love

General not, the new Felix is Ment to be a flawed combatant (he use to have -2 Will originally)
Also, as it is, he fluxes between 3'11 and 4'1 out of the suit: as to why: he is, Basically made of condensed mana with a natural curative state: IE, he is made of healing potions; thus his heal. Also, after finding that out, he might have allowed himself to be pressed into being overly... Generous ;3
What hospital would not beg barrow and steal for something that just Heals physical trauma on pare with meta regeneration?

Yes, Base is what is paid for by attribute points, and then the others are as they are seem

And yes, the powers marked "Alt" are out of suit only, as per GK's comment, they are weaker alt powers, and as it is set up at present, they are adding a full +1 point cost to each power (that aren't even set to increments of 5 in the first place I might add :3)
I'll admit having them there is a lil confusing, but I wanted it clear what each Alt power was tied to.
And, all the powers marked as "Alt" are locked out while in the mecha: for example, he can't use the heal in the suit, he has to risk getting out of the suit to heal.

Also, the heal is tied to the magic Array, not to Create, Sorry if I made that unclear. The Eldrich blast is based off Magic which is just a rename of the blast power, as both are simply ranged damage. No idea why they listed it as a separate power, but meh, I thought it fit
So he can nuke them or, by rolling real low, nuke himself and maybe allies
Further, the magic ray is tied to the suit, no suit no magic aray (with the exception of heal)
Eldrich blast 10(12)pp
Create 10(12)pp Array cost 12(14)pp, 3 10(12)pp slots

The ground speed thing is inherently tied to growth: growth + 4-7 adds 1 speed rank, maybe writing it as:
Ground speed 3 3pp
-Ground speed 4 in suit

would work better?

As far as I know, Quickness stacks with itself, so quickness 2 and quickness 3 mental only works out to quickness 5 for mental tasks.
I Don't know if reading is tied to physical or mental so I just over killed it comically ^_^;
Also, distracting not fitting for reading makes sense, but if that is the case side, a effect making him less perceptive to whats going on around him works as well, lets say -8? 4 points worth.
then again, if reading is covered by mental, might just drop it and then add to his Str

The asterisk behind improved grab is because he got it by having the Extra Limbs power (a tail in this case) ;3


And yes, I'm fully aware of the defensive short comings: I don't like characters who can just do anything they like without fear of being below the curb. He is already nothing to ignore even with his weak points: He can make a wall, or walls and then start blasting and or walking through them while actively choosing who can or can't do the same. As is, he has a abusable power set and giving him no real short coming would make him boring.
Though I do think, depending on GK's ruling, he might have to drop all his walls to blast, but that is a small price to pay. for the raw versatility they offer as is. That, and letting the rest of the team just pelt the poor buggers is overly useful as is.
(the ruling being: if he changes off of Create to another power in the array do the walls all go poof or can he keep on making free actions to maintain them every turn?)

Addon: Forgot to mention it, but drop a skill down to fix the over spend, also fixed another minor error ^_^;

 

[GreenKarl]

Thanks [MENTION=4936]Shayuri[/MENTION], I was trying to figure out how to type this out myself last night

 

[Shayuri]

I suggest, as an alternate way to represent your alternate abilities, use an alternate form container?

So you'd have

Battlesuit (Removable)
Growth 6 7pp
-Permanent, Innate, removable

Density Increase 4 5pp
-Permanent, Innate, removable

== Note - I don't know what 'density' is as a power. It's not on the SRD that I saw. I assume it just adds to Str and Stamina, while imposing some kind of weight-related disadvantage that makes it cheaper than just buying more ranks in attributes?

Impervious Toughness 11 10pp

Speed +1, 1pp

Magic Array
- Blast
- Create
- Healing

Then you have:

Alternate Form: Not In Suit
Enhanced Attributes:
- Dexterity 2, 4pp (this is necessary because it's hard to have a power reduce an attribute. Instead buy it as the lowest form, then increase it for the out of suit form)
- Agility 4, 8pp

And note that the Alternate Form replaces your battlesuit powers...as a result, it costs you only 1pp per ability in it, as long as its total value doesn't exceed the total value of the battlesuit powers. It's basically just a more readable way to say they're in an array with the battlesuit powers.

This does effectively reduce your total character point rating by a LOT when you're not in your suit...but that's how most battlesuits work, so its coo'.

Some of your powers are of course, universal...applying equally when inside the suit and when outside. These include:

Speed 3, 3pp
Quickness (etc)
Jumping
Senses

And all that. I'll leave the point tally between you and GK.