Monk Attacks / Feats

[Halfabee]

If a Monk with the Dirty Fighting and Circle Kick Feats (from Sword and Fist) makes a successful unarmed attack, Dirty Fighting would allow an additional 1d4 damage, and then the Monk would also get additional followup attack (aimed at a different opponent in the monk's threatened range), because of the Circle Kick feat. I don't see anything in the feat descriptions that disallow a second occurance of the Dirty Fighting 1d4 bonus if the Circle Kick attack was also successful.

Is this correct? Does Dirty Fighting apply to all successful melee attacks in a round (including "bonus" attacks resulting from other feats)?

 

[Crothian]

Nope. Dirty fighting and circle kick cannot be done in the same round. Each take a full attack, meaning you get only one attack when you use either one of these feats.

As an editorial on them: They both are worthless, don't take them and get other feats.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Like Eagle Claw Attack!

-Hyp.

 

[Pagan priest]

Do we dare to hope that in the 3.5 Player's Handbook we might get to see a revised version of these nearly worthless feats?

 

[Crothian]

Well, to save Dirty fighting there was a second feat that was pretty much as worthless invented and posted to the Wizards web site. Hopefully, they changed their minds and went in a different direction on that one.

 

[Dr. Zoom]

As an editorial on them: They both are worthless, don't take them and get other feats.

I agree for the most part. Dirty Fighting can be a good feat for local thugs to accost low level heroes. Imagine a bunch of half-orc fighters and rogues trained by the local thieves' guild with this feat.

 

[Halfabee]

Grappling Grab-bag . . . (ouch!)

Each take a full attack, meaning you get only one attack when you use either one of these feats.

Ah - details, details. Thanks for the feedback.


Now for another tack - I haven't used grapling before, and am trying to learn how it works in the game - hopefully I can get some clarification here.

If I understand the sequence of grappling correctly, a character first has to make a melee touch attack to grab the opponent. If this is successful, then he has to make a grapple check. If this check is successful, the character is grappling, and normal unarmed damage is inflicted (subdual, if a non-monk character).

Is initiating the grapple considered the first attack, such that remaining attacks can then be made, without fear of breaking the grapple?

I'd appreciate any clarification on grappling folks might have to offer, or information on the nuances of how it's handled in the game (and interesting ways it's been used by characters).

I'd also like to incorporate holds (i.e. choke holds) and locks into the game - a character could choke (until unconscious . . . or worse), or get an opponent in a arm, wrist, or leg lock - with a followthrough that could break bones. Grappling a fighter-type to the ground and disabling (or at least slowing him down) by breaking a wrist or arm be a powerful option for a monk, and not unrealistic. Of course, there would be difficulty checks for this.

Has anyone done this?

 

[Wraithdrit]

On your second track here is my opinion. Stay within the current grappling rules. You do damage when you win in a grapple. As a DM I would classify this as locks and holds.

If you have a monk who puts a grapple on a 1st level fighter and does half the guys hit points in damage, that sure sounds like a broken arm or something like that to me. But if he does the same damage to someone who has 50 hit points, well that guy is just damn tougher and is resisting you getting the hold right, or has real good ability at getting out of them without getting to hurt, etc. If you managed to hold the grapple for a few rounds and combine up to do a good number of hit points then maybe you have finally successfully broken a limb, or some such.

This allows the flavor of such holds and attacks without getting into the whole making up of new rules that might break game balance. If you want to add extra flavor like allowing monks to first gain a grapple then do a sort of coup de grace within the grapple I would suggest it taking a full round action and then resulting in either an assassin like fortitude save or something similar.

- Wraith

 

[Halfabee]

I agree with your comments on taking damage during the grapple, but just pure damage doesn't effect the wounded character like a broken wrist would to someone wielding a sword. But that's opening a whole can of worms that the game has not really addressed - details of damage, and how it effects a character.

I agree - game balance is a valid concern, if there are no balances for this from the opponents' perspective.