Monks finally get even?

[Bloodweaver1]

Ok after reading some of the forums on the WoTC site about combining Battle Fist & Supreme Unarmed Strike, I got too wondering.

Say a warforged is a first level monk and has two battle fists (one for each hand), what is its unarmed damage score?

Same warforged at thrid level likes the damage he is doing and picks Supreme Unarmed Strike for a bit more pain. What is its unarmed damage score?

Adventureing is going well. After barely defeating a BBEG it reaches sixth level and comes to realize it needs to do more damage. So it picks up Improved Natural Attack. What is its unarmed damage score?

After rumaging through the BBEG's treasure chest, it finds a 'Monk's Belt' and puts it on. Finally, what is its umarmed damage score now?

So ultimately what stacks, what doesn't, and how much damage could a sixth level warforged monk do with Flurry of Blows.

-Blood

 

[Deset Gled]

Ok after reading some of the forums on the WoTC site about combining Battle Fist & Supreme Unarmed Strike, I got too wondering.

Say a warforged is a first level monk and has two battle fists (one for each hand), what is its unarmed damage score?

Same warforged at thrid level likes the damage he is doing and picks Supreme Unarmed Strike for a bit more pain. What is its unarmed damage score?

Adventureing is going well. After barely defeating a BBEG it reaches sixth level and comes to realize it needs to do more damage. So it picks up Improved Natural Attack. What is its unarmed damage score?

After rumaging through the BBEG's treasure chest, it finds a 'Monk's Belt' and puts it on. Finally, what is its umarmed damage score now?

So ultimately what stacks, what doesn't, and how much damage could a sixth level warforged monk do with Flurry of Blows.

-Blood

Fixed that for you

That is to say, if you want to have this thread be any kind of productful, I suggest you ask all the other questions you asked, and leave INA out of it. The most recent thread on INA was shut down, and the Mods kindly asked us not to bring the subject up again for a bit.

I'll try and come back with some real answers once I have access to my books.

 

[Bloodweaver1]

Fixed that for you

That is to say, if you want to have this thread be any kind of productful, I suggest you ask all the other questions you asked, and leave INA out of it. The most recent thread on INA was shut down, and the Mods kindly asked us not to bring the subject up again for a bit.

I'll try and come back with some real answers once I have access to my books.

However, a Warforged has a natural slam attack, so it does qualify for the feat regardless of whether it takes levels in monk. Not too sure if the nulifies the possible debate or not.

-Blood

 

[Artoomis]

However, a Warforged has a natural slam attack, so it does qualify for the feat regardless of whether it takes levels in monk. Not too sure if the nulifies the possible debate or not.

-Blood

Well, certainly we are mature enough to at least say, for the sake ar argument, that it can take INA, okay? No need to even discuss it.

 

[Sejs]

Well, certainly we are mature enough to at least say, for the sake ar argument, that it can take INA, okay? No need to even discuss it.

Seconded. In the interests of avoiding us all going around and around on the INA issue, let's just assume for the sake of the thread that they qualify.

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

It doesn't nullify the debate.... I didn't follow the entire thread *this* time as the previous three times beat the skeletal horse to death.

One major glitch with the warforged build is a question of which standard to use with the attach sequence.. Are battle fists manufactured weapons {and not Monk weapons} meaning the normal iteratives, or are they improvements on the natural slam attacks {no iteratives} or are they usable with the monks progression?

That has to be answered before the damage question.. and happens to be the rotting meat underlying the previous 4 threads

{edit-- wow.. I type slow }

 

[Plane Sailing]

Moderator Note: For the moment, please leave INA out of this thread. It causes long, acrimonius discussions and is likely to sidetrack everything else.

Thanks.

 

[ValhallaGH]

Say a warforged is a first level monk and has two battle fists (one for each hand), what is its unarmed damage score?

I'm wondering what sort of insane GM allows a first level PC to have 5,200 gp of magic items.


I mean, I'm crazy but even I wouldn't do that.

 

[Sejs]

Okay, starting from the top:

Say a warforged is a first level monk

Warforged Monk (1): Unarmed Strike 1d6, Slam 1d4. If he wants to use the slam and the unarmed strike in the same round, he's got to take the normal penalties for mixing natural and manufacured weapons (-5 to hit, -2 with multiattack)

and has two battle fists (one for each hand), what is its unarmed damage score?

First off, I'd say (quite firmly) that the benefit of two battlefists do not stack. That is to say he does not get 2 size adjustments, etc. Just one. If, for the sake of appearance, you want your battlefists to be a pair of battlefists that's perfectly cool, but you don't gain the effect twice. Anyway, that said.

Warforged Monk (1) with Battlefists: Unarmed Strike 1d8, Slam 1d8. Both unarmed attacks and slams now have a +1 enhancement bonus. The warforged is now using the large creature table for monk unarmed damage.

Same warforged at thrid level likes the damage he is doing and picks Supreme Unarmed Strike for a bit more pain. What is its unarmed damage score?

You need to be a 4th level monk in order to take Supreme Unarmed Strike, because of the BAB requirement (+3). For the sake of simplicity, we'll say that the DM is a nice guy and lets you take Supreme Unarmed Strike as your lvl 6 monk bonus feat, that way it doesn't mess with the next point, below.

Warforged Monk (6) with Battlefists and Supreme Unarmed Strike: Unarmed Strike 2d8, Slam 1d8. Both have a +1 enhancement bonus. The warforged is effectivly attacking with their unarmed strike as if they were a 10th level large monk.

Adventureing is going well. After barely defeating a BBEG it reaches sixth level and comes to realize it needs to do more damage. So it picks up Improved Natural Attack. What is its unarmed damage score?

Warforged Monk (6) with Battlefists, Supreme Unarmed Strike, and Improved Natural Attack (Unarmed Strike): Unarmed Strike 3d8, Slam 1d8. Both have a +1 enhancement bonus. The warforged is now effectivly attacking with their unarmed strike as if they were a 10th level huge monk.

After rumaging through the BBEG's treasure chest, it finds a 'Monk's Belt' and puts it on. Finally, what is its umarmed damage score now?

Warforged Monk (6) with Battlefists, Supreme Unarmed Strike, Improved Natural Attack (Unarmed Strike), and Monk's Belt: Unarmed Strike 4d6, Slam 1d8. Both have a +1 enhancement bonus. The warforged is now effectivly attacking with their unarmed strike as if they were a 14th level huge monk.

So ultimately what stacks, what doesn't, and how much damage could a sixth level warforged monk do with Flurry of Blows.

What stacks: Just about everything, other than the dual battlefists (as they're the same item). An argument could be made for the battlefists not stacking with INA because they're both effective size increases, but neither have any notes to the contrary. Of the set, that's the most gray area. Multiple effective size increases.

As for how much damage the monk could put out? A lot. Assuming they hit, anyway. Assuming they flurry (a better option than including the slam, at this point) and both attacks hit, you'd be looking at 10-50 damage not counting possible strength modifier.

Which is ridiculous for a 6th level character, frankly. But there you have it.

 

[Sejs]

Also of note: as ValhallaGM pointed out, a battlefist isn't something you nip down to the corner store and pick up - it's a 2600gp magic item. Something to bear in mind.

Other point. After level 12 the monk's unarmed damage will no longer advance. They're walking around with an effective +8 (+4 feat, +4 belt) to their monk level for the purpose of calculating unarmed strike damage, and the table for such stops dead at 20th and does not advance even in epic levels.