D&D (2024) Monster manual Fey video up

[Yaarel]

I'm not saying that some of the changes aren't also motivated by story reasons. But none of these things are happening in a vacuum.

It's not like this sort of thing is even unique to 5.24. A5E already just made most creatures not have an alignment trait, so that it only applies to certain extraplanars and high level clerics. And Tales of the Valiant doesn't have alignment. It's just different ways of heading off the biological morality issue that has always been kind of an uncomfortable background detail of the game for years.

If Tales Of The Valiant lacks alignment, then does its cosmology also lack the Outer Planes?

 

[Chaosmancer]

One could argue that feeling you to have to make some changes already gives an opportunity to make other changes you might otherwise not have bothered with by themselves.

Just speculation of course, but I feel your post was looking for such.

Sure... but they felt they HAD to change monstrosities because they were poorly defined and not cohesive as a concept. So, by your logic, that opened them up to making other changes.

 

[Chaltab]

If Tales Of The Valiant lacks alignment, then does its cosmology also lack the Outer Planes?

I'm not entirely clear on the cosmology of the Labyrinth but it certainly has the equivalent of outer planes. There's just no alignment in character's stats.

 

[Tonguez]

Sure... but they felt they HAD to change monstrosities because they were poorly defined and not cohesive as a concept. So, by your logic, that opened them up to making other changes.

really the changes have just made everything including monstrosities less cohesive as a concept, now if they were going back to the archaic meaning of Monstre as "large uncanny beast" I could accept that, but then would need to wonder about Wargs and Yeth Hounds and other uncanny beasts that arent monstrosities:

And bugbears look like this:
View attachment 394338

I could see that being a Monstrosity 'Hell Bear"
but I really dont like that association of Bugbears with Bears since the words arent related and the respective mythologies (the bogeyman stalking the dark v the large hefty bear) clash. That image is nice, but in my mind its not a Bugbear

 

[Chaosmancer]

really the changes have just made everything including monstrosities less cohesive as a concept, now if they were going back to the archaic meaning of Monstre as "large uncanny beast" I could accept that, but then would need to wonder about Wargs and Yeth Hounds and other uncanny beasts that arent monstrosities:

But that isn't the definition they are using. They are using "was something else, changed into this via magical forces" and yes, those are generic magical forces, and not specific ones such as Far Realms Corruption, Fiendish magic, ect. It is about as good of a category as "rock music

 

[Sacrosanct]

I could see that being a Monstrosity 'Hell Bear"
but I really dont like that association of Bugbears with Bears since the words arent related and the respective mythologies (the bogeyman stalking the dark v the large hefty bear) clash. That image is nice, but in my mind its not a Bugbear

I don't think it's the image in a most peoples' minds (thanks to D&D). But the point of that book was to stay true to the original folklore, and in Welsh folklore, the bugbear is an actual bear that appears to be slightly decomposed (not undead though) with a ghostly aura. It's not even evil. It just feeds off of fear.

 

[Tonguez]

I don't think it's the image in a most peoples' minds (thanks to D&D). But the point of that book was to stay true to the original folklore, and in Welsh folklore, the bugbear is an actual bear that appears to be slightly decomposed (not undead though) with a ghostly aura. It's not even evil. It just feeds off of fear.

The welsh word for Bear is Arth, I'd be interested to know your source for the decomposing bear in Welsh folklore

Generally Bugbear is derived from bwgan+bar meaning wrathful ghost/goblin. In Welsh Folk usage Bugbear was applied to Scarecrows (tall, thin figures in the shadows)

 

[Yaarel]

The welsh word for Bear is Arth, I'd be interested to know your source for the decomposing bear in Welsh folklore

Generally Bugbear is derived from bwgan+bar meaning wrathful ghost/goblin. In Welsh Folk usage Bugbear was applied to Scarecrows (tall, thin figures in the shadows)

In medieval England, the "bugbear" was a "spooky bear" that lurked in the woods. A translation of Italian La Spiritata from 1500s portrays it this way. Hence the term is often used generally for anything that is both spooky and dangerous, such as by Shakespeare 1600s in Troylus and Cressida. The "bug", bugge, bogey, boogie, also relating to "puck", relates to the goblin spookiness as a hostile fey creature of fairy tales. Because the folkbelief was often told to frighten children, it sometimes connotes an imaginary threat, and today is also used to describe an ongoing pet peeve.

The D&D 2024 Bugbear seems to tap well into the dangerousness, lurking, outofsight, and fey aspects of the reallife lore.

 

[Sacrosanct]

The welsh word for Bear is Arth, I'd be interested to know your source for the decomposing bear in Welsh folklore

Generally Bugbear is derived from bwgan+bar meaning wrathful ghost/goblin. In Welsh Folk usage Bugbear was applied to Scarecrows (tall, thin figures in the shadows)

The word "bugbear" obviously isn't Welsh. The original Welsh is "bwg". But for the term bugbear and how it's described comes from A Dictionary of Fairies: Hobgoblins, Brownies, Bogies, and Other Supernatural Creatures by Katharine Mary Briggs in 1976, who gets her description from Gillian Edwards' Hobgoblin and Street Puck and from an Italian play published in 1565 called The Buggbear.