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5E Mythic Odysseys of Theros on DNDBeyhond


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TwoSix

Unserious gamer
Supporter
Only if you zip through player options (my group is on their same characters from when we started 5e almost 6 years ago) or don't llike 3pp content. Personally I would have been fine with only the PHB options and everything else being 3PP.
Wow; excluding one-shots, my next character will be my 13th for a continuing campaign.
 

Are the Mythic Trait rules variable enough so that way you could include them on "boss" type enemies in the game, like say giving Cryovain, from Dragon of Icespire Castle, a Mythic trait to make him more boss like, or it just lists examples for just the three Mythic Monsters in Theros book?
 


dave2008

Legend
Are the Mythic Trait rules variable enough so that way you could include them on "boss" type enemies in the game, like say giving Cryovain, from Dragon of Icespire Castle, a Mythic trait to make him more boss like, or it just lists examples for just the three Mythic Monsters in Theros book?
There are just the examples in the book, but you can use the concept on other monsters if you want. It is a way to get a "boss" monster without using a higher CR monster.
 

Are the Mythic Trait rules variable enough so that way you could include them on "boss" type enemies in the game, like say giving Cryovain, from Dragon of Icespire Castle, a Mythic trait to make him more boss like, or it just lists examples for just the three Mythic Monsters in Theros book?
There are just the examples in the book, but you can use the concept on other monsters if you want. It is a way to get a "boss" monster without using a higher CR monster.
Cue a multitude of low CRs with mythic traits. RIP adventurers.
 

Basically all you do to make a Mythic Trait is:

  1. When the creature falls to 0 HP, it regains X amount of HP (and maybe tempory hit points too if you want).
  2. It gains access to 2-3 new legendary actions (called Mythic Actions) that are stronger than normal legendary actions (for example, a Claw legendary action becomes Swipe - two claw attacks instead of one).
  3. Something visually transforms during the encounter once this happens.
Easy!

Give the monster lair actions, normal legendary actions, and legendary resistance too, which is all pretty standard stuff.
 

darjr

I crit!
Also consider transformation too. Like the spider god bursting open with giant swarms of spiders pouring out. So now it’s a swarm or has allies.
 

darjr

I crit!
Oh and the general feature won’t be a secret to players, especially when they face these. The secret is out.
 

Marandahir

Crown-Forester
I especially like the supernatural gifts - they remind me of 4e Themes.

In 4e, Dark Sun introduced themes as a way of emulating that 3rd level start - essentially you got an extra encounter power (in 4e, your second encounter power was at 3rd level). Later on, Dragon Magazine introduced Themes for the standard Nerath-assumed setting, and not only had a single power granted at 1st level with the taking of the theme but had a series of features throughout the Heroic tier of play, a sort of equivalent extra layer of gameplay to that of the Paragon Paths and Epic Destinies for higher-tier gameplay.

In 5e, we got Backgrounds, which took on some of the traits of the Heroic Themes from 4e in their story-roles and having one critical roleplaying feature. But they're ultimately more benign and purposed towards giving you a ribbon link into the story of the game, and less about giving you a super special awesome power like many of the 4e Themes were. In that sense, they are like half-way between a 4e Background and a 4e Theme.

I've long considered the answer to the "Dark Sun characters are tougher", and likewise for similar settings, to be: give everyone a bonus feat. Humans get 2 if they choose variant human. And that, in essence, is what Supernatural Gifts are, though they are clearly designed around 1st-level characters rather than something you can come into over the course of your adventure. Even then, the sidebar says that on a rare ocassion, you might be gifted later on (of course, at the DM's purview). To that end, these are akin to the Epic Boons from the Dungeon Master's Guide, though clearly designed for the lower tiers rather than for the highest of highest tiers of gameplay. And in that sense, they harken back to the 4e Themes.

It's a really cool module that partially answers the promise of D&D Next's plug-in modules of gameplay to turn it into different types of game.

I think for my game, I might link supernatural gifts & feats with races and give every race a power boost of sorts. In my setting, rather than warforged, the dwarves are literally created in the forges of their parents' household, build as a child rather than born aux natural. In that sense, I'd add the anvilwrought feature to the dwarf racial characteristics. At the same time, if a player had a really interesting story like for some reason they were transformed from metal into a flesh being like the humans are, then they could substitute it with a separate feat or supernatural gift and the game would work as normal.

To compensate for higher powered heroes, I would wonder if it's worth raising the CR of encounters by 1/4 or 1/2 or 1, though I'd guess that in Theros, the point is that you're so heroic that you can bash up the same challenges with less difficulty, so rather than making the encounters harder, one might add an additional encounter to the adventure day or just leave the heroes less exhausted by the end of the day. In Dark Sun, I imagine the point would be that the heroes are harder AND the encounters are harder, for example.
 

dave2008

Legend
I especially like the supernatural gifts - they remind me of 4e Themes.

In 4e, Dark Sun introduced themes as a way of emulating that 3rd level start - essentially you got an extra encounter power (in 4e, your second encounter power was at 3rd level). Later on, Dragon Magazine introduced Themes for the standard Nerath-assumed setting, and not only had a single power granted at 1st level with the taking of the theme but had a series of features throughout the Heroic tier of play, a sort of equivalent extra layer of gameplay to that of the Paragon Paths and Epic Destinies for higher-tier gameplay.

In 5e, we got Backgrounds, which took on some of the traits of the Heroic Themes from 4e in their story-roles and having one critical roleplaying feature. But they're ultimately more benign and purposed towards giving you a ribbon link into the story of the game, and less about giving you a super special awesome power like many of the 4e Themes were. In that sense, they are like half-way between a 4e Background and a 4e Theme.

I've long considered the answer to the "Dark Sun characters are tougher", and likewise for similar settings, to be: give everyone a bonus feat. Humans get 2 if they choose variant human. And that, in essence, is what Supernatural Gifts are, though they are clearly designed around 1st-level characters rather than something you can come into over the course of your adventure. Even then, the sidebar says that on a rare ocassion, you might be gifted later on (of course, at the DM's purview). To that end, these are akin to the Epic Boons from the Dungeon Master's Guide, though clearly designed for the lower tiers rather than for the highest of highest tiers of gameplay. And in that sense, they harken back to the 4e Themes.

It's a really cool module that partially answers the promise of D&D Next's plug-in modules of gameplay to turn it into different types of game.

I think for my game, I might link supernatural gifts & feats with races and give every race a power boost of sorts. In my setting, rather than warforged, the dwarves are literally created in the forges of their parents' household, build as a child rather than born aux natural. In that sense, I'd add the anvilwrought feature to the dwarf racial characteristics. At the same time, if a player had a really interesting story like for some reason they were transformed from metal into a flesh being like the humans are, then they could substitute it with a separate feat or supernatural gift and the game would work as normal.

To compensate for higher powered heroes, I would wonder if it's worth raising the CR of encounters by 1/4 or 1/2 or 1, though I'd guess that in Theros, the point is that you're so heroic that you can bash up the same challenges with less difficulty, so rather than making the encounters harder, one might add an additional encounter to the adventure day or just leave the heroes less exhausted by the end of the day. In Dark Sun, I imagine the point would be that the heroes are harder AND the encounters are harder, for example.
I still need to check those out.
 


Zaukrie

New Publisher
I don't understand why they are so reluctant to build out champions of gods that are unique......I see the piety tables/traits/whatever, but that's not really what I was hoping for. I would think that if the gods were real, their champions would be unique/different from each other in terms of power/abilities.

But, the book has some great, great stuff (and ok stuff too).
 

That's been true for a while, just need to look at the right 3PP.

Aye, may well be, but the 3PP stuff I'd seen so far very much wasn't. I mean monsters, sure, lots of good stuff, magic items, again, sure, but in both cases it's pretty much "as good" as WotC, and you can't get that much "better" in either case. Whereas all the races and subclasses I'd seen from 3PPs, including stuff people liked were between slightly worse (i.e. generally good but maybe screwing up a couple of conventions) and outright terrible (wildly overpowered or underpowered, abilities that are straight-up broken in either direction, abilities so badly worded the DM has to make up what they do, and so on). Whereas Dragonlords is just really shockingly solid - and indeed, it's better, I would say, than Theros, by a long margin in the race/subclass stakes.

But I will read the monsters later, and hopefully Theros excels there.

Also let's be real, I really like the Eloquence Bard. They're not as beautifully worked-in to an Greek Myth setting as the Dragonlords Bard subclass, but they're a really good Bard subclass. And Satyrs are a little dull (no music/dance-related abilities?!? Reveler isn't an ability, but at least they get two skills and an instrument, even if one of the skill is Performance, unlike the one skill most of the Theros races get, comparing poorly to the two a lot of PHB etc. races get), but +CHA and Magic Resistance, in 5E? Uhhhhh you're going to see a lot of these guys all of a sudden. Especially as they seem a cheery race and have an incredible art piece (one of my favourite in any 5E book).

Also the Supernatural Gifts seem pretty great, and compare well with Dragonlords' Fated Destinies or whatever they're called. The art for Lifelong Companion was also delightful. I'm sure Patroclus can relate.

I know the art here is mostly drawn from MtG, but it is absolutely great.
 
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dave2008

Legend
Aye, may well be, but the 3PP stuff I'd seen so far very much wasn't. I mean monsters, sure, lots of good stuff, magic items, again, sure, but in both cases it's pretty much "as good" as WotC, and you can't get that much "better" in either case. Whereas all the races and subclasses I'd seen from 3PPs, including stuff people liked were between slightly worse (i.e. generally good but maybe screwing up a couple of conventions) and outright terrible (wildly overpowered or underpowered, abilities that are straight-up broken in either direction, abilities so badly worded the DM has to make up what they do, and so on). Whereas Dragonlords is just really shockingly solid - and indeed, it's better, I would say, than Theros, by a long margin in the race/subclass stakes.

But I will read the monsters later, and hopefully Theros excels there.

Also let's be real, I really like the Eloquence Bard. They're not as beautifully worked-in to an Greek Myth setting as the Dragonlords Bard subclass, but they're a really good Bard subclass. And Satyrs are a little dull (no music/dance-related abilities?!? Reveler isn't an ability, but at least they get two skills and an instrument, even if one of the skill is Performance, unlike the one skill most of the Theros races get, comparing poorly to the two a lot of PHB etc. races get), but +CHA and Magic Resistance, in 5E? Uhhhhh you're going to see a lot of these guys all of a sudden. Especially as they seem a cheery race and have an incredible art piece (one of my favourite in any 5E book).

Also the Supernatural Gifts seem pretty great, and compare well with Dragonlords' Fated Destinies or whatever they're called. The art for Lifelong Companion was also delightful. I'm sure Patroclus can relate.

I know the art here is mostly drawn from MtG, but it is absolutely great.
Regarding monsters: this may be my favorite monster supplement yet. The mythic monsters are interesting and the concept is easily adaptable to make any monster a boss monster. The is a neat section on new Theros lore for existing monsters and the Theran Chimera and custom chimera tables are really fun.
 

TwoSix

Unserious gamer
Supporter
Aye, may well be, but the 3PP stuff I'd seen so far very much wasn't. I mean monsters, sure, lots of good stuff, magic items, again, sure, but in both cases it's pretty much "as good" as WotC, and you can't get that much "better" in either case. Whereas all the races and subclasses I'd seen from 3PPs, including stuff people liked were between slightly worse (i.e. generally good but maybe screwing up a couple of conventions) and outright terrible (wildly overpowered or underpowered, abilities that are straight-up broken in either direction, abilities so badly worded the DM has to make up what they do, and so on). Whereas Dragonlords is just really shockingly solid - and indeed, it's better, I would say, than Theros, by a long margin in the race/subclass stakes.
Well, I think the evaluation is always going to be weighted against 3PP in the regards, because WotC gets to set the overall boundaries of what's considered "balanced" and what's considered a "convention". If a 3PP had put out a class like Paladin, or set conventions like what the Hexblade set, it would have gotten laughed at.
 

Thank you for this comparison. I don't usually buy settings but I will buy the Odyssey of the Dragonlords now that we can compare.

A lot of it is in the free player-book - Odyssey of the Dragonlords: Player's Guide - Modiphius | Free Products | RPG Quickstarts | Odyssey of the Dragonlords | DriveThruRPG.com

That's got all the races and subclasses, it's actually kind of a shockingly good offering for the price of "free". The main product is a 1-15 mega-adventure with the setting worked in, as I understand it.
 

slobster

Hero
I like the mythic monster implementation. In fact, I think it looks cool to use for another Magic setting, the recently released Ikoria, where monsters in the wild mutate and evolve in response to challenges, growing new limbs/new powers/new capabilities as circumstances challenge them.

I could imagine a low level monster that has a Mythic ability that lets it grow random or even context dependent new powers like tougher skin, an extra head, wings, burrowing claws, etc. Really hits the flavor of mutations in monsters, but also makes for more unpredictable and hopefully memorable encounters with wild monsters, that sap more of a party's strength without being endless waves of goblins or something.

Looks cool!
 

Well, I think the evaluation is always going to be weighted against 3PP in the regards, because WotC gets to set the overall boundaries of what's considered "balanced" and what's considered a "convention". If a 3PP had put out a class like Paladin, or set conventions like what the Hexblade set, it would have gotten laughed at.

Definitely agree. WotC got a taste of this with the Mystic - it was slightly too flexible, but overall power-wise, it comes in behind Wizard, Druid, and Bard, maybe Cleric even, and that level of power, in an entirely new class, was clearly not acceptable to a lot of people (there were other reasons too, but that was a key one).

Hexblade is a very good example, too, yeah if that was 3PP people would think it was pretty silly.

Indeed, we have an example right here with the Supernatural Gifts. It would be considered pretty extreme to just add them on top of normal PC stuff if they were 3PP. They are very powerful.

That said, the races are bizarrely underwhelming (aside from the Satyr). They compare rather unfavourably with PHB races. I mean, really, how much is WotC valuing a 1d4+STR natural attack? Because it seems like they're assigning it a similar value to, say, Darkvision, or a cantrip, or multiple spells or something. When the actual value to any given PC is extremely close to zero.
 

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