Need Help Swashing Buckles!!-Darklone, waiting for your insight!

The Unfettered is a really nice class, but I agree with the poster above: Works for AU, but seems slightly too powerful for core DnD.

My take on this character: I'd go for a Fighter 4:Rogue 6. If you get to keep the same stats and add the level bonuses, then I'd go for

Str 18 Dex 18 Con 16 Int 14 Wis 10 Chr 16.

Some feats:
Quickdraw - because it looks cool (and lets throwing daggers be useful).
Improved initiative - this guy sounds like he'd be fast and it works well with sneak attack.
2 weapon fighting, improved 2 weapon fighting.
Combat expertise, 2 weapon defense - parrying.
Improved disarm...
Improved Critical - Rapier. (although most recent level would have to be in fighter to meet Base attack requirements).

Depending on the type of game, I'd switch out Improved Critical for Leadership and take a cohort of some sort - the high charisma would help...

You'd end up with 20 fighter skill points (climb, jump?) and 99 Rogue ones - all the tumbling, bluffing (and sense motive!), appraising that you'd ever need... could probably pick up some whole new areas of skills if you wanted to. Stealth would be good... for getting away from angry husbands :)

You'd get evasion, 3D6 sneak attack, uncanny dodge... all very nasty.

In the way of items, something to boost your will save might be nice - it'd be bad (+3)... although I reckon that would fit in with the character...
 

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d100- I will try and find a copy and take a look. Sounds good

Darklone- A full sheet isn't necessary, but I won't complain. Level and feat breakdowns are more what I am looking for

Inconsequenti-AL- Thank you for the feedback.

I will try to post more again this afternoon- Darklone, looking forward to your suggestions.

THANKS!
 

One quick note, I have decided againast the Duelist completely as he will always wear at least leather armor and will fight 2-weapon 95% of the time.
 

OK. At this point I would want to take a look at the Dragon 301 for more ideas, but I have ruled out Unfettered (Parrying magic? Although I liked the AC bonus) and the Swashbuckler from Complete Warrior. I looked at it this evening and it did not impress me. Only 4 skill points and the special abilities just weren't all that. The lucky and grace abilities are cool, but the others just don't do it for me. Using Fighter/Rogue combo seems to be the best bet. I am worried about AC, but we'll see what happens.

Darklone, I'd still appreciate seeing what you've got.
 



Well, if I was to make such a character based on your description it would be something like this.

************

Human Fighter 3/Rogue 4/Swashbuckler 3: Size M; HD 4d6+6d10+30; hp 80; Init +4; Spd 30 ft.; AC 17/18 (+2 armor, +1 shield, +4 dex, /+1 dodge bonus from Dodge feat); Base attack bonus +9, Melee attack +13, Ranged attack +13, Rapier +13/+8 (1d6+4[+6*] 18-20*2), Dagger (Main-Gauche) +13/+8 (1d4+2[+4] 19-20*2), Mighty longbow +13/+8 (1d8+4 20*3); SV Fort +10 (+7 base), Ref +11 (+6 base), Will +3 (+3 base); Str 18, Dex 18, Con 16, Int 14, Wis 10, Cha 16.

Languages Spoken: Common, +2 more.

Skills: Appraise +10 (8ranks), Balance +13 (7ranks,+2synergy bonus), Bluff +13 (10ranks), Climb +11 (7ranks), Diplomacy +17 (10ranks, +4synergy bonus), Disguise +8/10 (5ranks[+2synergy bonus when impersonating]), Gather information +8, (5ranks), Hide +9 (5ranks), Intimidate +8 (3ranks, +2synergy bonus), Jump +13 (7ranks, +2synergy bonus), Listen +5 (5ranks), Move Silently +8 (5ranks), Perform(juggling) +8 (5ranks), Sense motive +5 (5ranks), Spot +5 (5ranks), Swim +12 (8ranks), Tumble +19 (13ranks, 2synergy bonus).

Feats: Human bonus/Expertise, 1/Improved disarm, Fighter 1/Two weapon fighting, 3/Dodge, Fighter 2/Quick draw, 6/Improved buckler defence, 9/Improved two weapon fighting.

Class abilities: Simple weapon proficiency, Martial weapon proficiency, Hand crossbow proficiency, Light armor proficiency, Medium armor proficiency, Heavy armor proficiency, Sneak attack +2d6, Evasion, Trap sense +1, Uncanny dodge (retains dexterity bonus to AC when flat-footed), Weapon finesse, Grace +1, Insightful strike, 2 fighter bonus feats.

Full attack: Rapier +11/+6 (1d6+4[+6*]) and Dagger +11/+6 (1d4+2[+4*])

*When damaging opponents not immune to criticals the characters intelligence bonus is added to the damage.

***********

This character has a lot going for it and only a few problems, the major one being low AC. This can be somewhat helped by changing to a Chain shirt, preferably magical, and getting a magical buckler as well. At 10th level it should not be out of your league to have +2 versions of both, bringing your AC up to 23/24. Depending on the campaign that may still be low and a ring of protection or some other protective item might be wise.

A possible slightly different build would be to replace the improved two weapon fighting with Improved critical (rapier) and use a defending Main-gauche to improve AC.

Further advancement can be tailored to taste. My suggestion would be going straight fighter from here on to get plenty of interesting combat feats like the greater two weapon fighting, improved critical, elusive target, weapon focus, and weapon specialization.
 

Thanks monboesen! I appreciate the effort! I'll keep checking back for Darklone's suggestions, try to take a look at that Dragon mag and try to put something together with my DM from what's here. I will post up what we decide to go with after everything is said and done.
 

am181d said:
Two-Weapon Fighting, Two-Weapon Defense, Weapon Finesse, Combat Expertise, Improved Disarm, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Persuasive, Acrobatic

The last two are for flavor, and could be swapped out for Weapon Focus and Weapon Specialization. You'll need at least a 13 int for Combat Expertise and Improved Disarm.
fett527 said:
Must be two-weapon focused with Rapier/MG
Must be lightly armored
Must use Tumbling
Must have equivalent ability to parry
Must have disarm
Must be charming and disarming (BLuff I'm thinking)
Ok... finally got all the books in one place.

I had a look at some other variants (Swashbuckler, Brigand from the Kalamar book and the ranger) but all of them lack feats to do what you want.

Your stats should be around:
Str- 18, Dex-17, Con-15, Int- 14, Wis 10, Cha- 16

You have two attribute increases which you could put into Dex and Con or two into dex to head for Greater Two Weapon Fighting (and perhaps G TWD) at level 11 or 12. I'd increase Dex and Con now though and push Dex to 19 at level 12 (if you don't get some strength or dex boosting items).

I will simply list now some possibilities from different books:
- Miniatures Handbook: Interesting feats would be Double Hit (both weapons with AoOs), Hurling Charge (throw weapon in a charge for additional attack), perhaps Sidestep(additional 5ft movement when you take an AoO) and Dash (movement +5 ft). Powerful Charge (+1d8 damage on charges) and its upgrade may be interesting for dashing swashbuckler attacks after throwing a dagger...
- Complete Warrior: Interesting Prestige classes: Exotic Weapon Master (if you want to use an Elven thinblade). You could use that trick to wield the thinblade with two hands... but I wouldn't use that for style reasons. Another nice feature of the class: You could use two light exotic weapons (perhaps Elven Lightblade?) at a -1 TWF penalty only and take Weapon Focus, Weapon Specialisation and Improved Critical for both... Interesting Feats: Flick of the Wrist (draw and throw one light weapon and catch your opponent flat-footed for that attack), the several Two Weapon Defense upgrades, Power Critical (+4 to confirm a threat, good with rapiers), Prone Attack is nice because enemies don't hit you better while you're down. The tactical Feats: Elusive Target with it's possibility to neuter Power Attacks is really nice. Prerequs: Dodge, Mobility, BAB +6. Sadly the weapon styles do not give any style feat for Rapier & Main-gauche, strange if you ask me, but that's it.
- Kalamar Players Guide: I don't like to admit it, but it's suboptimal for your build. The brigand class (updated available as update is similar to a rogue but with less skill points and less sneak attack damage. The benefits are a bonus to Bluff (+4) which helps with Feinting, the Eyes of Fury feat (make one opponent shaken if he fails Will save for 1 round as free action) and a d8 hitdice. Interesting here would be the Divine protection table... (page 146). Essentially all nobles of higher rank enjoy a certain divine protection from the gods who support their rulership. As a member of the royal family, your character would gain Uncanny Dodge, save bonuses vs. poison and charm spells, divine grace like a paladin and some other goodies such as noble bonus feats (bonuses to certain skills such as Diplomacy and Intimidate). I use these bonuses usually only for PCs though who take at least a third of their levels as Aristocrat. Interesting Feats: Gorgeous (charisma +2 for appearance, helps thus with Bluff, similar skills and the Eyes of Fury feat chain), Expert Tactician, Sprint (+10ft movement only in combat), Targeted Attack (instead of Critical hits apply Damage to a specific body part as per DMG p.27) and perhaps Unerring Strike (you deal less damage but hit a little bit better, look this up in the update sheets as well). There are other nice feats for style, but sadly you don't even have enough feats as it is...
- PHB: am181d listed some nice ones. I'd add Improved Critical though if you don't have a keen rapier.

Now... you are a level 10 human, e.g. 5 feats from your levels. Ftr 6 would yield another 4 bonus feats.

If you want to be evil and your DM approves (and does not care about multiclassing XP penalties), go for Rogue 1/Brigand 3/Fighter 6. Next 3 levels Rogue, then Fighter, you'll lose 2 points of BAB in the whole.

I'd get feats similar to monboesens approach.

Easier would be Ftr 6/ Rog 4. Your 9 feats may look like this. I wouldn't use Improved Buckler Defense, it lacks style, you suffer a -1 to hit (bad for your already TWF penalized attack bonus) and you should fight defensively pretty often to get high ACs.

TWF, Improved TWF, Weapon Focus Rapier, Two Weapon Defense, Improved Two Weapon Defense, Dodge, Mobility, Combat Reflexes, Double Hit.

I dropped Combat Expertise since you'll get more mileage out of fighting defensively with Two Weapon Defense (and upgrade) for a +7 to AC (+1 for Dodge) for a -4 to hit.. Double Hit will give you AoOs with both weapons. Not really necessary but flashy. Next feat should be Elusive Target or take it instead of Double Hit.

I'm not happy with the build... not enough feats :D
Flick of the Wrist and Hurling Charge would be nice, Quickdraw should be a must, he does not even have Improved Feinting and Improved Disarm... and you could really use Weapon Specialisation for more damage.

I'd get a magical elven chainmail+1 or +2 at all costs. This will put your AC at a nice 22 or 23 (5 + enhancement bonus + dex + TWD and ITWD) without Dodge or fighting defensively.

I am really sorry. I just hope you enjoy the list of possibilities here... but I guess I can't give much more advice than monboesen already did.
 
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One weird possibility: Go Ftr 10. This gives you 11 feats. One of these feats you spend for Skill Prodigy from the Kalamars Players Guide, this gives you two additional class skills. Pick Tumble and Diplomacy. Then talk your DM into using the Divine Protection stuff and enjoy the additional feats and higher BAB. :D

Post what you got and whether you have more questions... and don't forget that some magic items might grant feats as well ;)
 
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