Need Ideas: Balancing a Druid who doesn’t have spells.

[Brother Shatterstone]

Need Ideas: Balancing a Druid who doesn’t have spells.

I have a game starting up soon, with gestalt rules if it matters in anyone eye, and one of the players would like to take a druid that cannot casts spells...

Obviously this class would be significantly weak if one didn't compensate it. Anyhow she's not wanting it to be overly militant, neither is the other class, so besides weapon proficiencies, armor proficiencies, and BAB increases how would you balance out this class?

PS: I hope I got this in the right forum…

 

[Scion]

not wanting to be overly militant?

well, normally I would just say up the usefulness of the wildshape.. give it more options, more abilities, that sort of thing.. allow for extraordinaries, different creature types, some supernatural perhaps.. whatever

Also, take a look at various druid prcs. Some of those can be extended up to 20 levels, changing up a few abilities, and make it all work properly.

I think you may be looking more for houserules though.

 

[Brother Shatterstone]

I think you may be looking more for houserules though.

It was a toss up between this general or house rules but I read house rules as being a finished product, this form for debating core rules, and the general for debating non rule issues, so ahhh yeah I stuck it here... :shrugs:

You had some good ideas there I hadn't give much thought to looking at PrCs yet.

As for militant she doesn't want to look like a fighter or a ranger... Sort of hard to explains as I original pointed out that bonus feats could be used to help out ones defense.

 

[Scion]

Check out the shifter prc definately (but remember, it is considered pretty weak for various reasons)

natures warrior and warshaper are also interesting points.

If you have relics and rituals then check out the incarnate.. it is a druid that uses past lives for his forms

 

[Sejs]

Should be pretty easy.

Let them gestalt whatever their other class is, and instead of the other half being Druid/1-20, let it be Druid/5, Shifter/10, Nature's Warrior or Warshaper/5.

Work with the player as to what progression of the two PrCs, and how they'd inter-mix, that you'd both thing would be best.

 

[Darklone]

Get her the nymph, she'll already use a lot of spells and give her some healing and summoning as spell-like abilities.

 

[Li Shenron]

First of all, a player who doesn't want to either cast spells or be combat-effective should check with the DM is they are playing the right RPG And she "doesn't want to look like a ranger" too?

She must have already her own particular idea about a Druid, so why don't you ask her how she imagine her character, and then we know more

Perhaps she looks for a Druid which is really nature-oriented, and therefore doesn't practice magic because "it's unnatural", but at the same time she isn't a scout or armed nature's protector. In that case, what should be improved or expanded to compensate for the lack of spells are her abilities towards nature and animals.
For example, you can consider a few of the following ideas to grant her through her levels:

- An ability to brew potions which work like magic potions but they are not magic. Instead of being based on spells known it could be based on the use of Profession(Herbalist) skill.
- More than one animal companion.
- Some supernatural/extraordinary ability equivalent to the animal-oriented spells, making it clear that it is not a magic ability. This could be done by dramatically expanding the possible uses of Wild Empathy feature: for example, every new Druid level she could choose a new effect (similar to a spell which would be available at that level) that she can replicate by using WE.
- Increase the power and the flexibility of a couple of her minor class feature. For example, the Resist Nature's Lure could improve and later give immunity, or between Venom Immunity and Timeless Body you can give immunity to disease or faster recovery of HP and ability damage when resting.
- Ability to perform pagan non-magical rituals which reproduce some Divination effects through reading nature, such as watching the flocks of birds fly = Augury, 1/day at level 3rd.

I wouldn't change wild shape much to be honest.

 

[Darklone]

Does she imagine some Arthurian Merlin like druid figure or what? Perhaps some examples would help... to choose another class

 

[daTim]

What I'd do to compensate for loss of spells in a Druid... hmm. Well besides weapon/armor/BAB increases. Tough call since not only is the Druid losing ability to cast spells, but also spontaneously summon monsters, as well as the bonus of the Natural Spell feat.

Could start by increasing the bonus of Natures Sense to +4 or more, as well as granting a larger bonus to Wild Empathy, say another +4. Also a greater benefit on Resist natures Lure wouldnt be out of line. I'd also throw in the Alertness feat at the same level as Natures Sense, and Track at 3rd. Around 6th lvl you might want to throw in an immunity to disease to compliment Venom immunity. Lastly Fast Movement would fit in with a druid mighty fine at first level.

On top of all that, I'd give some more benefit to the Animal Companion. A +2 to Natural armor, and to the Str/Dex bonus at first level would beef it up nicely.

Do all of these things make up for losing spells? Maybe... but Druids have some powerful spell casting that really compliments their other abilities. Some other things you could consider would be a Natural Armor bonus at every 4th level perhaps, or include some sort of Natures Call ability, where he can "summon" certain animals or whatever would be in the local area to come to his aid. Sort of like Tarzan calling on Apes or Elephants to help him.

I wouldnt give in to increasing the BAB/Armor proficiences, thats not very druidic. If anything I'd give them a good Reflex save as well over that.

 

[DM_Matt]

Hmmm...so she doesn't want to be good at fighting...or casting, or, I assume, since she is going for druid flavor, social skills. I think that rather than deconstructing a druid, you should seek something else that does what she DOES want to be good at...If there's anythiong left