D&D 5E No One Plays High Level?

[Micah Sweet]

That is fine you are allowed to hate it but this kind of response is a conversation killer. How about some alternative proposal?
Even if the Bastion System is added, how does that effect your game. A) you do not play official D&D anymore and even if you do, simply not use the bastion system. It is bound to be an optional system and I would expect that the vast majority of tables would never use it.


I assumed no such thing, I just do not believe that any stronghold system requires "control of the base game". It is just some additional rules about the actions that strongholds can permit and the costs of creating and maintaining them. There are a number of "stronghold Rules " on DMSGuild and presumably also on DrivethruRPG but from what I have seen these are building and maintenance costs with very little in game effect.
I also reckon that there is little third-party support because not may third party designers use them or even think about them.
I would imagine that we got the bastion system UA because the designers have been looking at the old AD&D material in relation to the anniversary and some one thought that another look at Name level and Domain management might be of interest.

Level Up's stronghold system does a better job, IMO. So do the domain game designs of several creators of OSR games. Bastions only support the "personal power is all that matters" narrative WotC has been pushing.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Whatever you want to believe, WotC isn't in the habit of gambling lots of money on the off chance it will succeed to such a great degree that is still makes less money that is acceptable to Hasbro. There isn't enough money in wargaming unless WotC controls all of it, which they can't do. This isn't RPGs where D&D was already the 800 pound gorilla to begin with.

How do you know there isn't enough money in wargaming unless WotC controls all of it? Where are these "objective" statements coming from? Why is lack of popularity for certain options, when those options have received little visibility for decades and are therefore unfamiliar to the majority of current players, so easily assumed? Does it have anything to with the personal preferences of the posters in question?

 

[UngainlyTitan]

Level Up's stronghold system does a better job, IMO. So do the domain game designs of several creators of OSR games. Bastions only support the "personal power is all that matters" narrative WotC has been pushing.

Elaborate? What does it do? A better job compared to what? The Bastion System or MCDM's Strongholds and Followers?

 

[Micah Sweet]

Elaborate? What does it do? A better job compared to what? The Bastion System or MCDM's Strongholds and Followers?

Better than the Bastion system. Can't speak to MCDM, as I haven't read it. I can say that from what I've heard I prefer the philosophy behind MCDM over the simple power-up design of the Bastion system.

 

[Maxperson]

How do you know there isn't enough money in wargaming unless WotC controls all of it? Where are these "objective" statements coming from? Why is lack of popularity for certain options, when those options have received little visibility for decades and are therefore unfamiliar to the majority of current players, so easily assumed? Does it have anything to with the personal preferences of the posters in question?

You can look up how much the industry brought in and who the big players are.

 

[UngainlyTitan]

Better than the Bastion system. Can't speak to MCDM, as I haven't read it. I can say that from what I've heard I prefer the philosophy behind MCDM over the simple power-up design of the Bastion system.

So, sell it to me, what does it do?

 

[Micah Sweet]

So, sell it to me, what does it do?

Do you actually want to know, or are you baiting me with this?

 

[UngainlyTitan]

Do you actually want to know, or are you baiting me with this?

Of course, I want to know, why would I be baiting you and how would I bait you anyway? Call you rude names when you tell me? What does my opinion of you matter? What an extraordinary thing to say.

 

[Minigiant]

I think a lot of people are getting the entire idea twisted.

The official D&D version of a mass combat system, a domain management system, a home base system, an evil organization system, an apocalyptic event system, a planehoping system, templates and and variants for monsters, high high traps, or high level monsters... don't have to be books.

You can sit them in setting books. Mass combat in Dragonlance. Domains in Birthright. Apocalyptic events in Mentor Vale.

You can stick them in options books. TCOE and XTCE was filled with stuff.

"People won't buy that."

People bought supernatural weather and hazards .It was in Tashas

There wasn't any demand for that broken mess of a Twilight cleric, but we still got it.

 

[UngainlyTitan]

I think a lot of people are getting the entire idea twisted.

The official D&D version of a mass combat system, a domain management system, a home base system, an evil organization system, an apocalyptic event system, a planehoping system, templates and and variants for monsters, high high traps, or high level monsters... don't have to be books.

You can sit them in setting books. Mass combat in Dragonlance. Domains in Birthright. Apocalyptic events in Mentor Vale.

You can stick them in options books. TCOE and XTCE was filled with stuff.

"People won't buy that."

People bought supernatural weather and hazards .It was in Tashas

There wasn't any demand for that broken mess of a Twilight cleric, but we still got it.

I don't know I want any of those things but I think I would find them interesting if they appeared.