D&D General Nolzur creates inclusive miniatures, people can't handle it.

[Divine2021]

Great stuff, Wizkids, and we should all take note of whose mask is slipping in the reactions.

Yes, that’s exactly what we need, a witch hunt to punish the evil ones.

 

[Alzrius]

In my experience, a lot of people do, but people tend to get defensive when others suggest they may have unconscious biases and assume they are being accused of active bigotry.

I've seen it be the opposite more often than not; people tend to throw around accusations (and make no mistake, they're phrased as accusations) of unconscious bias as a deflection to talk about what they think people are "really" saying so they don't have to listen to what they're actually saying (and, worse, to make not-so-subtle comments about the other person's character).

Oh, I’m well aware that it hits very close to home. That’s exactly why people get so defensive about it. It’s an unfortunate result of our tendency to essentialize these things.

I meant more in that there are a lot of presumptions being made as to the nature of what goes into verisimilitude; it tends to be like "simulationism" in that people bring different baggage to the term, hindering discourse rather than abetting it.

 

[Charlaquin]

That's fair. But giants don't generally break the sense of immersion; they feel like they belong in a typical fantasy setting.

Exactly. And wheelchairs don’t feel like they belong in a typical fantasy setting. Which sucks if you’re a person who has a wheelchair and wants to participate in a fantasy roleplaying game. Which is why it’s worth putting in the work to make wheelchairs feel like they do belong in our fantasy settings

I have no problem with wheel chairs in a fantasy setting, or even magical ones; but I do have a problem with mundane ones functioning in ways they just can't. A wheel chair easily climbing stairs? Or navigating terrain that is seriously uneven and broken? That does break my sense of immersion.

What about this mini says the wheelchair must be mundane?

There is room for wheel chair bound adventurers. But just as someone bound to a wheel chair the the real world must sometimes acknowledge that not all locations and activities are suited to them, so must a wheel chair bound adventurer. If the first part of an adventure is climbing down a mile-high shaft into the Underdark, I have a hard time seeing how a wheel chair isn't a serious impediment. And hand waving it just isn't satisfying to me.

Absolutely. Part of good disability representation is recognizing that disabilities, well, limit ability. We don’t want to just handwave those limitations away, we want to utilize the power of fantasy to come up with creative solutions to those limitations. What cool magical and/or engineering features might a D&D adventurer’s dungeon wheelchair have that allow it to function in those situations where a wheelchair otherwise wouldn’t be able to? We should be putting our creative effort into imagining ways to make wheelchairs feel like they do belong in the setting instead of imagining reasons they can’t.

 

[GuyBoy]

The minis are great.
More importantly, they are inclusive. Inclusion is a wonderful thing because it makes life better for many people.
It doesn’t make life worse for anyone at all....... except for those who choose to let it enrage them, just because they need to hate. And these people need calling out and opposing. Always.

 

[Charlaquin]

Or just don't overly worry about it. Assume the dungeon corridors are ADA compliant and get on with the killing and looting.

That is an option, but it’s not necessarily always the best one. My disabled partner (mobility-limited, but not wheelchair-bound, to be clear) usually gives their D&D characters disabilities of some sort, and specifically wants those disabilities to, well, disable their characters in some way, because that’s a part of their experience they want the game to reflect. We work together to come up with ways to mechanically express those disabilities that feel appropriate without being too harsh to deal with.

Now, obviously that’s not going to be every disabled person’s preference; there’s also going to be folks who just want the representation and don’t want it to inconvenience gameplay, and we should do what we can to make the game welcoming to those people too. Just noting that sometimes part of representing someone’s experience faithfully is honoring and depicting the challenges they face.

 

[Frozen_Heart]

That's fair. But giants don't generally break the sense of immersion; they feel like they belong in a typical fantasy setting.

I've got to say that some settings giants (including the dnd and warhammer giants) do break my sense of immersion. Either by being so big it gets ridiculous, or by looking like someone just scaled up humans and called it a day.

It's why I like giants from skyrim or GoT so much. Their proportions are completely inhuman and look far more convincing for a creature of that size.

 

[Charlaquin]

This was what struck me during the kerfuffle awhile back when someone posted their homebrew rules on Twitter for a combat wheelchair - some people were very happy to see themselves represented in the game, and some people explicitly made comments along the lines of, “…dude, I use a wheelchair in real life. I don’t play this game to still have to use a wheelchair.”

Groups of real-life people aren’t monolithic.

That’s why I think it’s best to focus on the idea of making wheelchairs in general feel like they belong in the setting. Any individual player may want to play a character with a wheelchair or might not want to, whether they have a wheelchair in real life or not. The important thing is that, for those who do want to, the fictional setting has room for them to do so, without feeling out of place.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Seems like how these things are handled should be a table or personal decision. Too many variables otherwise. Some people are definitely going to want those minis though, and I'm glad they have them.

 

[Warpiglet-7]

Seems like how these things are handled should be a table or personal decision. Too many variables otherwise. Some people are definitely going to want those minis though, and I'm glad they have them.

That just it. Makes them happy and does not take away from my campaigns one iota.

And who knows? I cannot say for certain I won’t play with someone who wants/needs this kind of mini.

 

[mamba]

It's why I like giants from skyrim or GoT so much. Their proportions are completely inhuman and look far more convincing for a creature of that size.

I am not seeing it

I see no real difference between these and D&D ones that makes them more believable