D&D (2024) Not loving weapon mastery with beginners

[TheSword]

There's no way weapon mastery is more complicated for a brand new player than spells. You only have one weapon, there isn't even a decision to make so it really only slows things down as being another step in the process that needs to be explained.

Spells are far more complicated in terms of the decision-making process, but you can bypass the decision-making delays by informing the new player which spell(s) would work best, and then spells are quicker.

‘‘Twas a rhetorical question but I agree.

 

[Scribe]

Are they baked into the classes?

Just dont use the rules. I dont have the book, but I was under the impression these are riders, on the basic rules from 5e. Just dont use em.

 

[Zardnaar]

Just dont use the rules. I dont have the book, but I was under the impression these are riders, on the basic rules from 5e. Just dont use em.

Maybe don't dismiss the concerns then?

I'm seeing similar issues in 2014 from level 1-3 let alone comparing 5E to say C&C with the sane newer players.

They're still figuring out what dice to roll session 2 or 3.

Can be mitigated if they ask advice a lot don't or won't.

 

[DrJawaPhD]

2014 you can opt out of spells by not playing them.

2024 seems you can't opt out of complexity for beginners.

You can't opt out of complexity? Who is stopping you? Everything is optional, it's not like WotC sends Pinkertons after you for tweaking the rules

 

[Zardnaar]

You can't opt out of complexity? Who is stopping you? Everything is optional, it's not like WotC sends Pinkertons after you for tweaking the rules

Talking about RAW. Sone DMs wont know or layers will get salty for stripping out shiniest. They may not understand it but they want it.

Traditional pattern is revisions are more complicated but sell less. They cater to veterans vs newbies.

 

[Scribe]

Talking about RAW. Sone DMs wont know or layers will get salty for stripping out shiniest. They may not understand it but they want it.

Traditional pattern is revisions are more complicated but sell less. They cater to veterans vs newbies.

Sure, if you are binding yourself by RAW, you have to use them.

 

[DrJawaPhD]

Talking about RAW. Sone DMs wont know or layers will get salty for stripping out shiniest. They may not understand it but they want it.

Traditional pattern is revisions are more complicated but sell less. They cater to veterans vs newbies.

Well yeah, as a player I wouldn't join a table with a DM who thinks Weapon Mastery rules are too complicated to use.

That doesn't mean the DM is somehow forced to change their rules to suit me, it's their table and they make the rules. If you want a simple table then go ahead and simplify the rules and invite players who like those changes

 

[Guest 7037866]

Well yeah, as a player I wouldn't join a table with a DM who thinks Weapon Mastery rules are too complicated to use.

9 times out of 10 it isn't the DM who thinks such things, it is from watching players struggle with understanding how their character's features work--and other players getting frustrated waiting on that player or the DM having to explain something several times.

Frankly, I don't care for Weapon Mastery rules because they are "auto".... things that happen just because... like Push moving a target back up to 10 feet without any consideration other than it being Large or smaller. I understand the removal of a STR save or something was to keep the game moving faster, but I just don't care for such features.

 

[TiQuinn]

So, to clarify, this specific new thing that was added substantially slows the game down for beginners, and slightly slows the game down for veterans. Spells were already in the game, so that is included in the math when I refer to slowing down the game compared to the old rules. Which I thought was kind of obvious.

I think the question is how do you approach spellcasting with beginners and why are weapon masteries different. It’s not obvious why it’s slowing down the game for beginners because all of it is new, including spells. Since so many classes have spells, what’s the difference between a beginner picking up the mechanics of a spell vs a weapon mastery?

 

[Zardnaar]

I think the question is how do you approach spellcasting with beginners and why are weapon masteries different. It’s not obvious why it’s slowing down the game for beginners because all of it is new, including spells. Since so many classes have spells, what’s the difference between a beginner picking up the mechanics of a spell vs a weapon mastery?

Generally they don't pick hardcore spelkcasters.

Smart ones who do ask for advice on what's good or figure out it out.

The "don't tell me how to play" types and the ones who think spellcasters make good frontliners (without knowing how to do that) figure ot out, get killed or the game/group falls apart.