D&D 5E On Representation and Roleplaying

[Oofta]

Yeah. Complaining about a creator making their fantasy world actually culturally diverse instead of yet another fantasy Europe is exactly the sort of unhelpful attitude I alluded to earlier.

Also, as using European influences never elicits such complaints regardless of the creator’s ethnic background, it just strengthens that culture’s position as the dominant default.

I think this attitude holds back the game. I would love new setting material that was inspired by different cultures that I could mine for ideas. But we're stuck with the same-old-same-old because the moment you have a book who's lead author is caucasian that is not based on the same old psuedo-fantasy Europe tropes the controversy storm immediately erupts.

It's not like the "acceptable fantasy setting" bears much resemblance to real world mythology or history, but it's been done to death so it's somehow okay. I think we should be sensitive, I also don't think there should be an author ancestry filter to determine who can create specific works, especially when it's okay if that ancestry goes back generations.

 

[Oofta]

But that worry is valid, and is an okay take to have, even more so in the beggining of campaign 3, where we haven't seen how Mercer made Marquet.



Raising questions and saying you are worried is not the same as passing judgement, or saying someone is not allowed to write about a topic. This feels like a strawman to me. Sure, straight up saying "white people aren't allowed to write about other cultures" is wrong, but who's saying that?

I would just refer you back to the article again. The author passed judgement without watching a single episode.

 

[Vaalingrade]

I think it's sad, because Native Americans are basically ignored in popular culture now.

Isn't the real sad thing that once all the disparaging and insulting mentions in pop culture about the First Nations is removed, there's basically none left?

Like lazy creators think they're all headresses, magic nature men, eye candy, werewolves and literally nothing else? Maybe that's the problem and not telling creators to put in even the slightest effort to do better?

At this point, I believe that the issue in pop culture isn't overt racism but the fundamental laziness of writers who are very willing to take the shortcuts and then argue and justify putting in bad faith work. "Well if you don't want to be portrayed as a werewolf sex princess, I don't know what to tell you. Stop being so sensitive and appreciate that is even gave you the basic attention to show you in buckskins and feather headdresses that your ancestors never actually wore."

 

[Micah Sweet]

Companies are usually very risk-averse. If they're not sure they won't offend people with a depiction, the safer course is not to do it at all. You'd see a lot more effort and creativity if there wasn't a worry about losing money.

 

[Vaalingrade]

Companies are usually very risk-averse. If they're not sure they won't offend people with a depiction, the safer course is not to do it at all. You'd see a lot more effort and creativity if there wasn't a worry about losing money.

We accept this awful excuse from companies because we expect and tacitly allow them to be terrible for a dollar.

That doesn't excuse independent creators.

 

[jmartkdr2]

But it should be possible for J. Random Anycolor to write a setting with any set of cultures, without having to hire cultural sensitivity readers and whatnot.

It's possible, much like Mr. Anycolor can edit his own work and learn to draw in order to do his own illustrations. But getting others to help is often the better route.

Otherwise you're adding a burden of time, cost, and a political filter onto everything that gets published, and ultimately selecting out all the people who don't want to deal with the new and changing requirements.

Well, yes, good writing takes time and researching to get the setting right takes research. Editing was already a burden, and we've effectively removed the upfront costs of printing books, which means more people can get started on the cheap. The political filters are different, because modern audiences have different expectations because they're more likely to be aware of issues coming form racism. It's not like writing offensive content (and the reasons to do so or not) is a new thing.

(who goes after "cultural sensitivity" careers?)

It's a good side-gig for anthropologists and sociologists and so on.

 

[jmartkdr2]

I personally haven't seen backlash against someone for using a culture they do not represent if they've hired cultural and sensitivity consultants, no matter their "size". Not that it didn't happen, I just haven't seen it.

If you wanted to, you could find someone who was offended... but that's always the case. "Did this offend anyone?" isn't a useful standard for any purpose.

I don't watch CR myself, but I'm willing to bet their version is about as good as anyone can realistically do, because it's pretty clear they're trying and have the resources to do it right. Until I see significant evidence otherwise, I'll assume good intent.

 

[Ixal]

One problem I have with the "respectful representation" is that whenever you want to use something from a non-European culture you have to go all-in as otherwise it is not respectful.
You can't steal just some minor thing to use, no you have to invent a full "not" country with all its customs, populated by culture appropriate monsters and the people there having the correct ethnicity.
That means that no matter how fantastical you want to make a world, you will always end up with the same kind of "not-China", "not-Japan" and "not-Africa" etc. which imo has become a stereotype of its own.
There is no such problem when using European culture. No one cares when you "disrespect" them, or no one takes the ones who complain about it seriously.

Another form of representation in RPGs I encountered is disability, although so far only in Paizo products. And to be honest it is imo rather bad because it is obvious that it was an afterthought which was only added in later and does not make sense in a setting where you can easily regenerate body parts.

Its especially glaring in Starfinder when a wheelchair costs multiple times as much as a cybernetic limp or spine and is just slightly cheaper than a complete body regeneration. And thats just for the base version of the wheelchair, not the upgraded ones.

 

[payn]

Another form of representation in RPGs I encountered is disability, although so far only in Paizo products. And to be honest it is imo rather bad because it is obvious that it was an afterthought which was only added in later and does not make sense in a setting where you can easily regenerate body parts.

Its especially glaring in Starfinder when a wheelchair costs multiple times as much as a cybernetic limp or spine and is just slightly cheaper than a complete body regeneration. And thats just for the base version of the wheelchair, not the upgraded ones.

This falls into that same line of thinking that gender swapping belts in D&D ought to explain away any transgender rep in a fantasy world with magic. I know it wasn't intentional, but its basically trying to wipe out a persons identity like its a problem they can just fix in the game. So, having wheelchairs in a sci-fi setting allows folks who need them to represent themselves in such games even though there are ways of removing the need entirely.

 

[Vaalingrade]

One problem I have with the "respectful representation" is that whenever you want to use something from a non-European culture you have to go all-in as otherwise it is not respectful.

Someone hasn't tried to include Celtic or Norse elements in anything lately.