Brother Shatterstone
Dark Moderator of PbP
Wow! I just confirmed my own stupidity…Endur said:
[OOC] House Millithor in City of the Spider Queen
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Serpenteye
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Excellent, now I have some hope that this situation will resolve itself constructively. But no doubt those tricky bastards have something else in mind.Endur said:
There is still the question of what they were doing to Marcarius, and why...
Serpenteye
First Post
Endur said:
Ouch! For all the butt that Dariel kicked, Endur still got the better of that exchange. It sems that the outcome depends on the Illithids.
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Endur
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Since Illithids have incredibly high intelligence and wisdom, I'm willing to take suggestions as to what the Illithids could do to impact the fight.
Two of them are standard mindflayers, the third is a leveled psion mindflayer. I'll figure out Master Klaxeon is going to do, but what do you suggest the flunky mindflayers attempt?
Regular Mindflayer has the following abilities:
Mind Blast (which they will not use, too obvious and would also blast Dariel)
Charm Monster (useless to stop Endur from clobbering Dariel)
Detect Thoughts (could find out what Endur is planning next)
Levitate (useless)
Plane Shift (useless)
Suggestion (useful, but very obvious)
Near as I can figure, a suggestion is the only power worth mentioning. Unfortunately, the Mindflayers have to speak it out loud, so they have to get close and it will be darn obvious that is what they are doing.
Two of them are standard mindflayers, the third is a leveled psion mindflayer. I'll figure out Master Klaxeon is going to do, but what do you suggest the flunky mindflayers attempt?
Regular Mindflayer has the following abilities:
Mind Blast (which they will not use, too obvious and would also blast Dariel)
Charm Monster (useless to stop Endur from clobbering Dariel)
Detect Thoughts (could find out what Endur is planning next)
Levitate (useless)
Plane Shift (useless)
Suggestion (useful, but very obvious)
Near as I can figure, a suggestion is the only power worth mentioning. Unfortunately, the Mindflayers have to speak it out loud, so they have to get close and it will be darn obvious that is what they are doing.
Serpenteye
First Post
Endur said:
Are Illithids even capable of speach? I thought they did all their communication either by telepaty or trough their thralls. Since telepathy is their natural means of communication shouldn't they be allowed to make the Suggestion telepathically?
Endur
First Post
Excellent point. That's why I asked for advice.
Illithids can speak. Usually undercommon, but they prefer to use telepathy with a range of 100'.
The problem comes up because Suggestion is a spell-like ability in the Monster Manual. But if you look in the Psionics Book, it has an "Aural display", which means that when the Mind Flayer gives a suggestion, there is a loud humming noise, probably indicating that the Psion's suggestion is in another octave (i.e. the voice from Dune). Range is close, i.e. 45 feet. As such, it will be obvious. To everyone within 10 to 20 feet of the Mindflayer, if not everyone within 50 feet of the mindflayer.
I'm not decided either way. Just looking for a way to figure this out.
Illithids can speak. Usually undercommon, but they prefer to use telepathy with a range of 100'.
The problem comes up because Suggestion is a spell-like ability in the Monster Manual. But if you look in the Psionics Book, it has an "Aural display", which means that when the Mind Flayer gives a suggestion, there is a loud humming noise, probably indicating that the Psion's suggestion is in another octave (i.e. the voice from Dune). Range is close, i.e. 45 feet. As such, it will be obvious. To everyone within 10 to 20 feet of the Mindflayer, if not everyone within 50 feet of the mindflayer.
I'm not decided either way. Just looking for a way to figure this out.
Serpenteye said:
Serpenteye
First Post
But Spell-Like abilities have neither vocal, somatic or material components. The standard Illithid could cast Suggestion without components. Consequently the psionic Illithid should be able to manifest Suggestion without displays (the psionic equivalent of components).
Brother Shatterstone
Dark Moderator of PbP
Damn I'm at work and I was lazy this morning and I have none of my books with me...
Serpenteye's advice is sound to me.
but I'm curious, is the description for the Illithids in the MM or Psionics Book? I know there suppose to use their powers like Psionics but if they’re in there MM maybe that’s the rule set they intended for use.
I didn't find anything on the wizards website either...
Serpenteye's advice is sound to me.
but I'm curious, is the description for the Illithids in the MM or Psionics Book? I know there suppose to use their powers like Psionics but if they’re in there MM maybe that’s the rule set they intended for use.
I didn't find anything on the wizards website either...
Endur
First Post
Vote on Telepathy and Suggestion
In the psionics book, it states that all psionic powers are spell-like abilities. None of them have components, but some of the powers have various types of displays (auditory, visual, etc.).
And on page 139, for the psionics creature template (which is what Mindflayers have), it says that the psionic powers are manifested just like the powers that a psion would manifest.
The other issue is that both versions of the Suggestion spell (PHB, Psionics) state that the Suggestion is language-dependent. From the phb p.174, a language-dependent spell uses intelligible language as a medium for communication. That implies to me that either the "suggestion" has to be spoken aloud or it has to be understood and telepathy would be fine. Since the Psionics book knows all about telepathy and didn't mention anything about telepathy being an adequate substitute, I'm inclined to think the suggestion has to be spoken aloud.
I'm open minded and I'm not sure.
Let's put this up to a vote of the players. Can creatures that have telepathy use suggestion without speaking outloud? If enough players vote yes, than that's how I'll rule. If enough players don't vote yes, then I'll rule the other way.
In the psionics book, it states that all psionic powers are spell-like abilities. None of them have components, but some of the powers have various types of displays (auditory, visual, etc.).
And on page 139, for the psionics creature template (which is what Mindflayers have), it says that the psionic powers are manifested just like the powers that a psion would manifest.
The other issue is that both versions of the Suggestion spell (PHB, Psionics) state that the Suggestion is language-dependent. From the phb p.174, a language-dependent spell uses intelligible language as a medium for communication. That implies to me that either the "suggestion" has to be spoken aloud or it has to be understood and telepathy would be fine. Since the Psionics book knows all about telepathy and didn't mention anything about telepathy being an adequate substitute, I'm inclined to think the suggestion has to be spoken aloud.
I'm open minded and I'm not sure.
Let's put this up to a vote of the players. Can creatures that have telepathy use suggestion without speaking outloud? If enough players vote yes, than that's how I'll rule. If enough players don't vote yes, then I'll rule the other way.
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