OOC Kingdom of Ashes IV - Who's yo' daddy?

[Laurel]

Looking at this from Jaine's perspective: the transfer pregnancy idea should be the last resort... she is already shamed by having a child out of wedlock-- not only have a child out of wedlock... but, having the father of that child simply desert her to be with another woman mere days after their encounter. She is embarassed as all get out...
I think, we should explore the options of pulling a Queen Amidala: get a body double for Jaine... teleport the real Jaine and her nurses out of Hyrwl to someplace protected and safe (yet to be determined) where she can have the child.
After which, the child can be raised without any knowledge of his noble heritage.
It is not a whole lot better for Jaine... but, at least she gets to have her child without being propositioned by the woman that stole her husband-to-be... and, if she truly desires, she may be able to bring her son forward someday without have it be *weird*...
Picture this 18 years from now... well, yes, this is my son... but, I magically put him in this other chicks uterus... ya see, times were hard...
However, picture this 18 years from now... in midst of war and instability, I opted to give my child up for adoption... now that I am the queen of a stable county, I would like to bring him forward as a legitimate heir to my throne after my death.
Not totally thought out... but, something to think about, that's for sure... magic doesn't need to be the answer to everything... more importantly, there is a PrC designed specifically for the "Royal Body Double" thing... that in combination with a circlet of persuasion and a bitchin' cloak of cha. could make a pretty convincing Jaine.

Even if she just gives up the child at all 18 years from now she may be trying to tell someone or a whole kigdom of her shame and how times were hard. One way she transfers the baby so from pregnancy there is a link between mother and child or after, but the kid is still being given up. Only way stop those possibly futures is for her to keep the baby and publicly proclaim the out-of-wedlock kid.

In order to do the above plan option we need a safe place to send her and the maids to...?
Is there anyone she trusts that she could give the child to mark or not and be okay that the dirty laudry won't show up in 18 years or that she will not be blackmailed by a greedy person? Who would she give it to so it seems plausible for that person to have gotten the child? Do we wait and see if it bears the mark, and if it does have ring made and given to adopted mother?

Edit: Using the spell is on just someone- if there would be anyone Jaine could/would do this with. I think Xath would be the hardest choice for Jaine, but the easiest to answer questions. Overall though, and Jaine would have to agree it would solve her problem. She looses the baby, and only a very few know it has been transferred. No pesky questions, but it means with this route she does loose the child until or if she ever needs to/is willing to admit to the child.

But now we can add other idea to the list of Jaine's options, since she ultimately gets to decide and choose.

So
8) Royal double and adoption

 

[The_Universe]

Looking at this from Jaine's perspective: the transfer pregnancy idea should be the last resort... she is already shamed by having a child out of wedlock-- not only have a child out of wedlock... but, having the father of that child simply desert her to be with another woman mere days after their encounter. She is embarassed as all get out...

I think, we should explore the options of pulling a Queen Amidala: get a body double for Jaine... teleport the real Jaine and her nurses out of Hyrwl to someplace protected and safe (yet to be determined) where she can have the child.

After which, the child can be raised without any knowledge of his noble heritage.

It is not a whole lot better for Jaine... but, at least she gets to have her child without being propositioned by the woman that stole her husband-to-be... and, if she truly desires, she may be able to bring her son forward someday without have it be *weird*...

Picture this 18 years from now... well, yes, this is my son... but, I magically put him in this other chicks uterus... ya see, times were hard...

However, picture this 18 years from now... in midst of war and instability, I opted to give my child up for adoption... now that I am the queen of a stable county, I would like to bring him forward as a legitimate heir to my throne after my death.

Not totally thought out... but, something to think about, that's for sure... magic doesn't need to be the answer to everything... more importantly, there is a PrC designed specifically for the "Royal Body Double" thing... that in combination with a circlet of persuasion and a bitchin' cloak of cha. could make a pretty convincing Jaine.

Transferring the baby is no more shameful than a modern woman having an abortion in real life. Less so, in fact, since the child does not die. Getting rid of the child in a way that allows it to have a happy life may be what she chooses to do. Real mothers give up babies for adoption every day...this might be no more than a VERY EARLY adoption.

It's really not a matter, in a pragmatic sense, of personal shame. Its a matter of succession. Think about it in those terms. Jaine will have to be convinced no matter what - but all of her options suck right now, so try to remember that the line between right and wrong is not all that clear in this case.

 

[The_Universe]

A general note: as soon as Jaine seems to become not-pregnant, the child cannot be brought back in as a legitimate heir.

If this child ever wants to legally sit upon the Phoenix Throne, it must be born to Jaine, legitimately or otherwise. I was going to say publicly, but that's not precisely what I meant...she's not going to have the kid in the town square. But, people have to know that it is her child in order to make it a legitimate heir.

 

[The_Universe]

Direction, albeit not yet a plan....

On another note....

Am I right in saying that the msot important plan, as of the moment, is this:

1) The Circle of the Phoenix is going to travel to Caer Albion, to scout, and perhaps to plan some daring-doings

2) AB will be enlisted to use the Bluestar's forces to run interference on the Isle of Mourning. You hope to negotiate so that, should be find the blades, you can at least get a crack at them before they end up with ol' Blue - Eye.

3) Some sort of action will be taken, post-plan, in Caer Albion. Mik/Archon may be able to hire some mercenaries to help out. You also have Dwarves, Black Orcs, Ninjas, and the actual Army of the Phoenix to bring to bear, should you choose to.

Secondarily, you hope to:

1) Find out more about AB's oath, and why he's always gotta be such a ragin' bitch all the time.

2) Assuming he doesn't tell you, find out from an associate, maybe even Blue Eye himself.

3) Through whatever means necessary, break him from his oath

4) Make him marry Jaine and legitimize the child, obviating the need for a fetus-teleport spell, at sword-point if necessary.

5) Force them to live happily ever after, under pain of torture. (this will likely be achieved by removing all of AB's brooding equipment, and installing floodlamps to minimize shadows.

Tertiarily, you plan to:

This part is still fuzzy. But can you at least tell me if the primary and secondary are correct....?

 

[The_Universe]

While speculation has me in its wild and unyielding grip, might this be a good time to speak with dead with the fallen redmage, as Liz has sugggested, and perhaps to engage in a second round of Communism!?!?!?!?!

Come up with your questions and ask away.

 

[AIM-54]

The end goal cannot be retreat.

I'm picking out this phrase in particular as it is emblematic of your (and perhaps everyone else's) confusion/misunderstanding of the basic tenets of guerrilla warfare. The end goal can absolutely be retreat and in fact must be retreat, AFTER having achieved some objective. It does not have to be a big objective. You don't win a guerrilla war in big engagements. Indeed, those can only weaken us. We still need to consolidate the forces we have and expand them where we can (I believe Jaine and Co. are supposed to be in charge of recruiting, IIRC).

What we can do is SHOW THE FLAG. This is the most important thing we can do, in terms of the REBELLION. The reasons for this I have already gone over and won't go over again, unless someone has a specific question.

I'm not saying we don't go with the intent to encourage people to get out and live to fight another day. That would probably be the best thing we could do, we need the recruits. At the same time, we need to show that we are genuinely powerful and take out some bad guys.

Of course, if we're not fighting a guerrilla war, this is all irrelevant.

 

[Queen_Dopplepopolis]

I'm not saying we don't go with the intent to encourage people to get out and live to fight another day. That would probably be the best thing we could do, we need the recruits. At the same time, we need to show that we are genuinely powerful and take out some bad guys.

Based on the work that Mik did last night, we may be able to pull off something similar to a victory in Caer Albion... but, I don't know that I like that plan, either. Sacrifices too many of our troops... but, that's for another post...

Like I said, I do see the value in knocking out the heavy hitters and generals at Caer Albion...

The more people that survive Caer Albion, the more people we have on our side... and, based on the importance of some of those people, the more legitimacy we grant our rebellion.

All of my speculation is based on very little information. We must go and scout. Caer Albion is very different than Oceanus... being made of Mithril and all... so, it is a fight that is win-able... not by numbers... but, our end goal does not HAVE to be retreat... when I have more time, I'll post some of my ideas to knock out huge numbers of the draconic forces.

Convincing the people of Caer Albion to leave now and come back to fight when our force is larger and more in-charge...r seems, right now, to be the best option and the first avenue we should travel... but, if that does not work, we need to resort to something that will make us seems very powerful... not like a thorn in the side of the draconid forces.

 

[The_Universe]

I'm picking out this phrase in particular as it is emblematic of your (and perhaps everyone else's) confusion/misunderstanding of the basic tenets of guerrilla warfare. The end goal can absolutely be retreat and in fact must be retreat, AFTER having achieved some objective. It does not have to be a big objective. You don't win a guerrilla war in big engagements. Indeed, those can only weaken us. We still need to consolidate the forces we have and expand them where we can (I believe Jaine and Co. are supposed to be in charge of recruiting, IIRC).

What we can do is SHOW THE FLAG. This is the most important thing we can do, in terms of the REBELLION. The reasons for this I have already gone over and won't go over again, unless someone has a specific question.

I'm not saying we don't go with the intent to encourage people to get out and live to fight another day. That would probably be the best thing we could do, we need the recruits. At the same time, we need to show that we are genuinely powerful and take out some bad guys.

Of course, if we're not fighting a guerrilla war, this is all irrelevant.

I think what Liz is referring to is the fact that, if the people defending Caer Albion wished to retreat, they could do so at any time, unless the mage that appeared on your doorstep is not emblematic of the type of power they have at their disposal. But, based on what your PCs know, he probably is. The long and short of it is that Caer Albion can probably be evacuated at any given second.

That's why she's been saying that retreat in Caer Albion can't be your goal - it'd be like selling ice to an eskimo, if you get my meaning.

The people defending it don't want to abandon it, and unlike Oceanus, these guys aren't going to fold after a 45 minute invasion.

That being said, If you go up, do some damage, make some efficient plays, and it becomes apparent that they HAVE to abandon the city, your having been there might make sure that they evacuate to a place of your choosing and benefit, rather than a place to Tain's.

I hope that makes sense. I didn't think the essential parts of your messages were getting to each other, Liz and JC, so I thought I might be able to facilitate, a bit.

But the plan is proceeding apace - you know you're going to Caer Albion, and that makes me a happy panda!

 

[The_Universe]

WHOOOO! I'm on the front page of Enworld! Huzzah!

 

[Queen_Dopplepopolis]

WHOOOO! I'm on the front page of Enworld! Huzzah!

Yay for your successful spotting on the d20 Past cover!!

You're the winner! And famous!