Open Grave Excerpt: Rituals and Artifacts

[Korgoth]

The ritual for creating undead seems rather... boring to me. One zombie flunky that doesn't fight. Not exactly the gaming equivalent of a reckless celebrity bender. Now, I wouldn't have minded if they said zombie flunkies don't fight. But then why not just allow as many as you want? With one, you can't really make very much happen that's interesting.

I've always liked that Smith story where the two Necromancers walk into a kingdom wiped out by plague and start animating everything including horses. Pretty soon they're ruling an entire kingdom of the dead. Of course, because it's Smith, they rule in a way that is vile and wrong and ultimately tragic.

Anyway, in game terms, I think the "Empire of the Necromancers" approach is excellent because it makes something very interesting happen. I know a lot of DMs would balk at something like that in game:

"How many undead are you guys going to raise?"
"All of them."
"What? No... the spell doesn't work anymore."

But to me, that's what great tales are made of. Rather than be restrictive, so that everything happens in a way that is predictable and staid, why not let some crazy stuff happen? No matter what happens the DM is still in control. He just has to think of how to take what the PCs did and turn it into something interesting.

I'm reminded of the idea that came up in Knights of the Dinner Table, where the group finds all the cheap prices for livestock in the back of the PHB. So they buy up a bunch of chickens and goats and drive them ahead of the party through the dungeon, springing all the DM's precious deathtraps. I think that's a splendid idea! It would work great in some dungeons. Of course, the first time the herd runs into a nest of monsters, they'll lead them back to the party in their flight. Or if they run into an evil druid or an aboleth or something (like somebody with a Control Animals item) they'll all turn around and start biting the PCs! That's the stuff that great sessions are made of.

This is not an "edition wars" post. But I am puzzled at how little chaos seems to be present in 4E. Chaos is the stuff of legendary games, in my experience. I want to see crazy stuff: explosions, slaughters, rampaging herds of summoned dinosaurs, the rise and fall of kingdoms, etc. But I don't plan that stuff ahead of time. I want the crazy to emerge from the hairbrained schemes of players whose characters wield wealth and power beyond the limits of their feeble prudence.

 

[Spatula]

This is not an "edition wars" post. But I am puzzled at how little chaos seems to be present in 4E.

err, animate dead-type spells have been tightly controlled in D&D since 3e.

 

[Korgoth]

err, animate dead-type spells have always been tightly controlled in D&D.

That isn't correct.

OD&D: Roll 1d6 per level above 8th. That's how many skeletons or zombies you get per casting of the spell, assuming available corpses. The spell may be cast as often as it is memorized, with no upper limit. Undead last until dispelled or destroyed.

Classic: You get 1 HD of skeletons or zombies per caster level. The spell may be cast as often as it is memorized, with no upper limit. Undead last until dispelled or destroyed.

AD&D: You get 1 skeleton or 1 zombie per caster level. The spell may be cast as often as it is memorized, with no upper limit. Undead last until dispelled or destroyed.

4E: You get 1 zombie. It costs a lot of money. You can never ever have more than 1 zombie.

Big, big difference.

 

[Ahglock]

Is that a positive? *Didn't care for Libris Mortis -at all- compared to the 3e Draconomicon and both Fiendish Codices*

I think Libris Mortis was the best of those. So if this is the 4e Libris Mortis it will be awesome.

 

[Ahglock]

That isn't correct.

OD&D: Roll 1d6 per level above 8th. That's how many skeletons or zombies you get per casting of the spell, assuming available corpses. The spell may be cast as often as it is memorized, with no upper limit. Undead last until dispelled or destroyed.

Classic: You get 1 HD of skeletons or zombies per caster level. The spell may be cast as often as it is memorized, with no upper limit. Undead last until dispelled or destroyed.

AD&D: You get 1 skeleton or 1 zombie per caster level. The spell may be cast as often as it is memorized, with no upper limit. Undead last until dispelled or destroyed.

4E: You get 1 zombie. It costs a lot of money. You can never ever have more than 1 zombie.

Big, big difference.

Yeah and it never wrecked a game for us in earlier editions. I miss craziness sometimes. 4e offers different kind of fun though.

 

[Byronic]

I'd definitely lower the price of the ritual (although perhaps require something rare) and let them waive as much people as they can afford.

Wouldn't be a bad idea to make the ritual evil somehow. Maybe the rare item can be something that requires an evil act to make or obtain it. Or at least distasteful, this IS Necromancy. You shouldn't walk away with clean hands.

 

[Rechan]

Or at least distasteful, this IS Necromancy. You shouldn't walk away with clean hands.

Depends on your take on necromancy and what evil is.

 

[Spatula]

That isn't correct.

AD&D: You get 1 skeleton or 1 zombie per caster level. The spell may be cast as often as it is memorized, with no upper limit. Undead last until dispelled or destroyed.

My reading of the 1e animate dead was that you got <level> skeletons or zombies, and couldn't have any more, but I can see after looking at it a bit more closely that your interpreation might be the right one, and the limit is per casting.

 

[avin]

The ritual for creating undead seems rather... boring to me.

A cleric on my campaign was begging for some gremlin-like creatures under his command, for doing non combat stuff.

Now he can animate some halfling or goblins and have fun

 

[avin]

Depends on your take on necromancy and what evil is.

Agreed.

It doesn't look more evil than using bodies for medicine school, unless you use it for evil acts.

I see most necromancers are death students, not evil dudes trying to raise armies...