Pathfinder 1E Opinions on Pathfinder

[Hunter In Darkness]

Kinda enjoying the revisionist history going down here. Keep it up ,it is amusing

 

[ProfessorCirno]

Jesus, did someone really just say Paizo was to blame for Wizard cancelling the print versions of Dungeon and Dragon?

I can't imagine how big an axe has to be to grind it that far.

 

[ShinHakkaider]

Only for that niche of players that would use it. Continued research may have shown that the majority of players would not use the game table. The research may have also shown that of those players that use virtual tables many find existing methods to be adequate so as not to be interested in WotC's offering.

Yeah but you just said....

Well, geuss what? In business you need to make a decision and stick with it. If you approach something half-assed it is doomed to fail.

I would think that before publicly touting the D&D Character Visualizer and the Game Table as part of the DDI they would have done the research BEFORE HAND.

It's funny that you should bring this up because when Dannanger mentioned the Game Table loss as not such a big deal I went and googled D&D Game table and read some of the interviews that they did with Gamespy, Wired and other online media outlets touting the DDI and the Game table in particular as this great thing.

As far as a you claiming that only a niche of players would have used it, you dont know that. One of the selling points of the D&D Game Table by WOTC was that it could be used to get old gaming groups separated by geography together. WOTC has an edge over Maptools & Fantasy Grounds (which although they are frickin great products, they are also VERY niche products) by name recognition alone. I'd venture that most people coming back into the RPG fold with 4E would have found a use for the D&D Game Table as presented by WOTC. Especially since they were pushing it pretty hard along with the rest of the DDI.

Even still once I found out that the Game Table wasnt tied to 4E, I was interested in it! If there was going to be easy of use and not tied to the ruleset I would have at least tried it out. But I never got the chance because WOTC never delivered the product.

I also want to state upfront the lack of the DDI Game Table dosent mean that the rest of the DDI is crap. I'm sure it's a great product. It's just one that I have no use for, but I might have...

 

[BryonD]

Point the first, I think the argument is that 3E engenders the problem, which is a vast difference from imposing it.

Point the second, under what circumstance is your comment about "settling for 4e" remotely called for? It's bad enough I have to see your 4e dig in your sig every time you post, but I'd greatly appreciate refraining from comments like this that can clearly set off the powder keg nonsense that is the edition war.

As many have said time and again: Love 3e or hate 3e. Love 4e or hate 4e. Go nuts. But please, please spare us comments that imply your choice is somehow better.

For the specific game experience I want, 3E is far and away a superior choice.
If I only managed to imply that, then I apologize.

But I do find it amusing that in a PF thread loaded with digs against 3E that *THIS* post is setting off a powder keg.

 

[jaerdaph]

I just emailed a link to this thread to the state attorney general of Wisconsin - just in case their convicted murderers want to try and get their D&D books back again.

 

[ShinHakkaider]

That's not true. You absolutely can make the customers happy. Most of them, at least. But unfortunately the tabletop roleplaying customer base has a disproportionately high number of what can only be called bad customers - the spoiled, entitled sort that would rather whine about how they would do things differently instead of appreciating the reality of the situation the hobby is in. These customers are not worth pleasing. WotC was right to ignore them because, truthfully, driving them away from the hobby would only improve it.

WOW. While I agree to an extent that there are bad customers out there, this just comes across as if youre saying that everyone who decided NOT to follow WOTC are a bunch of spoiled brats. And if that is what youre implying that's a pretty foul attitude to have.

If that's not what you mean, then please elucidate. In less than harsh terms this time please...

The table was always designed as a part of DDI. What you're discussing is simply revisionism. The digital game table was simply supposed to be an option available to Insider subscribers. They ended up unable to complete it because the economy started to tank, corporate demanded cuts, and the software development team was seen as less important (and rightly so) than the RPG designers.

Didnt stop WOTC from laying off a bunch of their designers anyway though.

 

[Xyxox]

Paizo did not suffer from the loss of the magazines. They understood the business deal they made with WotC from the beginning. They are not the helpless little company that WotC stamped all over as you surmise. I'd go so far to say that, based on commentary from Erik Mona and the direction Paizo took after the "incident," Paizo benefited from losing the magazines. Erik spoke about the issues of being in the business of finding advertisers over that of just designing games. The magazine industry is dying. Online is the way to go for that media. They could have started their own magazine if that was a lucrative venture. IMO, I believe WotC intentionally acted as the "bad guys" in the decision to end the magazines to help protect their friends at Paizo. If the flak from the cancellation of the magazines had fallen on their shoulders they might not have recovered. WotC could withstand the hit as the larger company.

Are we remembering the same event?

 

[ProfessorCirno]

Wasn't WotC sending out C&D's at a few places who made their own 4e virtual tabletops at one point because they didn't want anyone cribbing them?

It might just be my bad memory.

Also, Shin, welcome to Dannager. If you dislike 4e for any reason other then "I'm crazy," then you're crazy and delusional.

 

[Dannager]

Wasn't WotC sending out C&D's at a few places who made their own 4e virtual tabletops at one point because they didn't want anyone cribbing them?

It might just be my bad memory.

Also, Shin, welcome to Dannager. If you dislike 4e for any reason other then "I'm crazy," then you're crazy and delusional.

Ooh, nice one. Next time I'll put inflammatory words in your mouth.

 

[Dannager]

WOW. While I agree to an extent that there are bad customers out there, this just comes across as if youre saying that everyone who decided NOT to follow WOTC are a bunch of spoiled brats. And if that is what youre implying that's a pretty foul attitude to have.

No, just that a fair number of them are. That's the unfortunate reality. It's difficult to look at our own community and see it, but that doesn't mean it isn't there. And it's not limited to 4e haters. There are plenty of fans of 4e who probably fit the same bill.

Didnt stop WOTC from laying off a bunch of their designers anyway though.

Nope, it sure didn't.