Paladin Behavior?

[Torm]

Because that is a DM rules issue. Otherwise it would not matter that the character is a paladin. A LG cleric or fighter can be in the same situation without a DM having to adjudicate whether the player loses his powers. The DM could just let the situation play out and let the character develop to his moral detriment or betterment. But with paladins there can be immediate mechanical game effects under the RAW.

I'm not sure you grokked me, so I'll try again - what I'm saying is, this seems to fall into one of those very aggravating areas where a player is clearly NOT playing a Paladin properly, and yet, there is nothing the DM should do about it going strictly by the rules. But it seems to be that there is more to being a Paladin than JUST your deity's approval - someone who is trying to get away with the bare minimum they can and still keep their class powers is clearly missing the point.

BTW, I don't think Superman had some greater being above granting him powers and giving him a code, wasn't he alone with his own choice?

I consider Superman very similar to a Paladin, because while you are correct that he doesn't have a code handed down by a deity, he DOES have a code that he decided on when he became Superman. He doesn't break that code, and on the few occasions that he has, he has punished himself far worse than I think most DMs would've if he WERE a D&D Paladin character.

 

[Anthraxus]

Keeping the evil sword so no one else can use it's power, until you can find a way to destroy it for good: Great!
Using the evil sword to fight things: Ehhh... Oookay...
Selling the sword(wittingly or unwittingly) to the BBEG's minions because you can MAKE A LOT OF MONEY!!!!: BAD!

-A

 

[Voadam]

I'm not sure you grokked me, so I'll try again - what I'm saying is, this seems to fall into one of those very aggravating areas where a player is clearly NOT playing a Paladin properly, and yet, there is nothing the DM should do about it going strictly by the rules. But it seems to be that there is more to being a Paladin than JUST your deity's approval - someone who is trying to get away with the bare minimum they can and still keep their class powers is clearly missing the point.

Someone who merely enjoys playing a "good guy" in a D&D game and sticks within the rules of a LG alignment no evil acts and no gross violations of the code, is doing it wrong and missing the point when he plays a paladin?

"is clearly NOT playing a Paladin properly"

I think there are two valid ways to view the paladin class, one as the ideal of heroism, and two as a good guy fighter with some specific rule guidelines.

You seem to view it as clearly the heroic ideal only so neutral actions by a paladin are just WRONG while I see nothing wrong with playing a good guy blessed fighter who must avoid evil actions to keep his powers, bright line rule.

 

[Torm]

I think there are two valid ways to view the paladin class, one as the ideal of heroism, and two as a good guy fighter with some specific rule guidelines.

I can see both of those. But - I'm TORM, so, obviously, in this matter I'm right.

Just kidding. I can see your point. I just don't quite understand why, if the latter is what you're going for, you would even want to play a Paladin - seems like it would be much easier (with less risk of losing your powers) to go LG Fighter or LG Fighter/Cleric and take a knight-like PrC than to actually go Paladin.....

 

[Lord Pendragon]

You seem to view it as clearly the heroic ideal only so neutral actions by a paladin are just WRONG

Myself, I do view the paladin as the heroic ideal. I think that's what the word "paladin" connotates. Sir Galahad, pure enough to find the Holy Grail. etc. etc. When I DM, this is the interpretation of the class that I go with. It's important to let the players know, though, so they can make an informed decision about whether they want to play a paladin as I view it.

This doesn't mean that I strip paladin powers for Neutral acts. But if after a while I start to feel the player is trying to sidestep the flavor of the class rather than embrace it, we have a problem.

...while I see nothing wrong with playing a good guy blessed fighter who must avoid evil actions to keep his powers, bright line rule.

It's flavor, I suppose. I call such characters Fighter/Clerics, or even plain Fighters with perhaps a few Exalted feats. The paladin is something rare and special--a hero in mind and spirit--and more than just a fighter who's a nice guy, and carries around a Miss Manners book in his backpack to keep from losing his powers.

At least, that's how I rule it in my games.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Removed

 

[Raven Crowking]

Removed

 

[Lord Pendragon]

For he who lies with unwashed dogs rises with fleas.

Nice.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Removed

 

[hong]

The paladin is something rare and special--a hero in mind and spirit--and more than just a fighter who's a nice guy, and carries around a Miss Manners book in his backpack to keep from losing his powers.

At least, that's how I rule it in my games.

So a fighter can't be a hero?