People don't optimize

[Neonchameleon]

A common statement made y peoe who make optimized characters is "why don't you take the best X, people always would try there best" but that isn't true

There's one major reason for me not trying my best at a lot of things. I don't care about the outcomes. If my PC doesn't care about the outcomes of the game, that means we have an issue with the stakes.

 

[triqui]

Well, this is a forum for "roleplaying" games; most players are trying to approach the game like "real people" on some level, though it varies greatly as to how they go about it and how hard they try.
.

Roleplaying isn't to approach the game like real people, it's to approach the game as a role. You pretend to act like the character would do, not like real people do. Real people run scared when a dragon appears. We pretend to be elves with magical powers, not plumbers from Ohio.

 

[triqui]

As long as your decision to play Superman doesn't render my decision to play Jimmy Olsen pointless (because I will never be able to contribute effectively in a game that ostensibly supports both character types), I'm fine with that.

Wouldn't that work both ways? I mean, your decision to pplay Jimmy Olsen shouldn't render his desire to play Superman, either.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

...plumbers from Ohio.

Hey! I know this plumber who rescued his girlfriend from a large, barrel-throwing ape...

 

[triqui]

Hey! I know this plumber who rescued his girlfriend from a large, barrel-throwing ape...

But he was italian. Italian Plumbers are epic. Specially when they eat mushrooms.

 

[FireLance]

Hey! I know this plumber who rescued his girlfriend from a large, barrel-throwing ape...

Reality used to be a friend of mine, too.

 

[Cor Azer]

Reality used to be a friend of mine, too.

Not me.

Stupid idiot kept taking half the water from my glass.

 

[Umbran]

I'm not an advocate of ultra-optimized munchkins for characters. But my reasons for not being a fan of that playstyle have nothing to do with "realism" or any attempt to mimick the real world.

Yeah, but Morrus, you didn't ask us why *you* do it. You asked it as a general question - why would anyone do this? Some, because they feel that mechanical optimization is not consistent with the semi-believable personality they're trying to get the character to have. It is an answer to the question. I didn't claim it was your answer.

This goes doubly when we consider that optimization isn't a one-time thing, but it requires maintenance as the character grows in power - to stay optimal, you must stick to the optimal build. But, game events may make the choice to stay on that optimal path unreasonable, from an in-character point of view.

As an example: say you're on your optimal path, and it includes several levels of a prestige class, and your GM is holding to the original presentation of Prestige classes, that you have to role-play through acquiring them. And, you just found out that the organization you'd have to join to get that prestige class is... evil to the core. And you're playing a Good character. Maybe staying optimal is now not a thing the character would do....

Roleplaying isn't to approach the game like real people, it's to approach the game as a role.

I don't believe you get to declare for the entire planet what roleplaying is or isn't. Sorry.

And, in any case, "real person" is a role one can choose to approach the game. Though actually, here I'm more interested in believable person - there's a difference, akin to the difference between "realism" and "verisimilitude" if you want to get into semantics. Let' us not go down the whole "realism in RPGs" strawman argument, please.

You pretend to act like the character would do, not like real people do. Real people run scared when a dragon appears.

The stunningly complete lack of actual dragons makes that pretty hard to assert.

However, our history is filled with verifiable cases of people facing threat of bodily harm with bravery. Soldiers holding up against impossible odds, firemen running into burning buildings, and all that. Bravery under threat is believable, as it does happen in our world.

 

[triqui]

I don't believe you get to declare for the entire planet what roleplaying is or isn't.

Of course not. I leave that job for people more prepared. Like Merriam-webster or the plethora of online dictionaries.

Definition of ROLE-PLAY
: act out
intransitive verb
: to play a role

role-play   [rohl-pley]
verb (used with object)
1.
to assume the attitudes, actions, and discourse of (another), especially in a make-believe situation in an effort to understand a differing point of view or social interaction.
2.
to experiment with or experience (a situation or viewpoint) by playing a role.

role-play (rōl'plā')
v. role-·played , role-·play·ing , role-·plays
To assume deliberately the part or role of; act out. n.
Role-playing.

role-play (rlpl)
v. role-played, role-play·ing, role-plays
v.tr.
To assume or represent in a drama; act out:
v.intr.
To assume or act out a particular role

And, in any case, "real person" (actually, here I'm more interested in believable person - there's a difference) is a role one can choose to approach the game.

A role always have to be believable to be good. However, that does not mean it has to be a "real person". If you are roleplaying a bloodthirsty half-minotaur, you shouldn't act as an Ohio Plumber. If you are roleplaying a shy gnome illusionist, you shouldn't act as an Ohio Plumber. If you are roleplaying a magical elf, you sholdn't act as an Ohio Plumber. Otherwise, you are playing RPG, but you aren`t role-playing, because role-playing means "to assume or act out a particular role". When Marlon Brando plays the role of a mafia's Godfather, he does not act as an Ohio Plumber, but as a mafia's godfather.

 

[Umbran]

Of course not. I leave that job for people more prepared. Like Merriam-webster or the plethora of online dictionaries.

Sorry, but in a niche area like RPGs, the term is jargon. Common dictionaries are authorities on the common use of terms, but not on jargon.

A role always have to be believable to be good.

Does it? "Good" is a subjective term, not an objective one....

However, that does not mean it has to be a "real person".

I think, if you read back, you'll find I didn't say it *had* to be.

I was arguing that it *could* be - and that if one were doing so, one might choose a less-than-optimal build.

Let me be clear - If you are arguing with me because you think I'm trying to knock optimized characters, stop. I am not arguing that it is wrong to play an optimized character. If you like it, knock yourself out. Have a blast. I am not trying to stop your fun.