PHBII has Half-Orcs and Goliaths

[Gothmog]

30 people? The lack of Summoning/Enchantment/Illusion/etc is one of the big complaints from the "4e haters".

Honestly, giving the 4e haters these spell specialties will have no effect. Or giving them gnomes, half-orcs, monks, bards, druids, etc. They will still find something to rant about, usually in regards to 4e doesn't equal 3e (thankfully). The 4e haters aren't going to be buying the 4e books, so letting their complaints drive design decisions seems completely nonsensical. I'd much rather see WotC push the limits of the game and give us new material than rehash and convert old stuff. Hopefully the various X Power books will do this, and the PHBs after PHB II will really allow 4e to shine.

 

[Merkuri]

Haven't there already been quotes to the fact that PHBII will be about half new and half old?

IMO, this would be the best way for them to go. A mix of old and new pleases both the people who miss things from 3e and the people who want to see brand new things. They'd be stupid not to do both in each book they release.

 

[Hawke]

Please, tell us where you got this inside information.

My guess is the Theurge is just speculation... though I think overall the presence of a divine controller in the book is highly likely based on the current status of roles.

 

[Rechan]

My guess is the Theurge is just speculation... though I think overall the presence of a divine controller in the book is highly likely based on the current status of roles.

Well yes; one of the designers mentioned toying with the idea in a podcast. However, I'm just curious how he was so adamantly sure of it.

There are, after all, 8 classes, 5 of which have letters unaccounted for.

 

[Hawke]

Yeah, rereading his post he seemed like that was an ironclad truth. Maybe we missed something!

5 classes unaccounted for... wow... it's going to be a long time until Spring!

 

[thundershot]

What I REALLY want to see in PHB2 is the return of "subsidiaries". Familiars, Animal Companions, Followers, Cohorts, Paladin Mounts, etc...



Chris

 

[jsaving]

Please, tell us where you got this inside information.

Not the original poster, but here's a summary of what we know so far.

All new classes will appear in either a PH or a PG, after which they'll be expanded upon in a splatbook. Knowing the bard and sorcerer and swordmage will all appear in Arcane Power tells us that those classes must appear in either the PH2, FRPG, or both. Rich Baker has said there will be exactly one new class in the FRPG, the swordmage, and that the swordmage will not be duplicated in the PH2. That gives us all the information we need to conclude that the bard and sorcerer must appear in the PH2.

Mike Mearls previously gave us the first letters of all eight PH2 classes: B, B, D, I, S, S, T, W. Based on this new information plus what Wizards has previously confirmed, that gives us:

B arbarian - primal striker or controller
B ard - arcane leader
D ruid - primal non-leader, possibly a hybrid role
I ?
S haman - primal leader
S orcerer - arcane controller
T ?
W ?

What do we know or at least suspect about the final three? Well, Andy Collins has mentioned a divine controller in the PH2 who uses flame strike and the like on foes, and it's certainly possible such a character could be called the theurge (or perhaps thaumaturgist). Some of the RPGAers have talked about a potential primal controller called the witch, though I don't believe any of the designers have officially mentioned such a class yet. And as to the "I" class, it's worth noting that the divine splatbook will make its debut before the PH3, which means the final PH2 class is very likely divine. A couple of the designers have talked about a completely-new-to-D&D striker making its debut in the PH2 -- perhaps it could be a divine Inquisitor? That's only a guess, but a reasonable one, based on the evidence to date.

 

[JackSmithIV]

Honestly, giving the 4e haters these spell specialties will have no effect.

I agree. Look at the way it is now: they're going to bring back the removed classes in a new capacity, with clearly-defined roles and balanced gameplay, and there are cries of 'unoriginality'. But when the information released that those classes and raceswould be pulled out of the first iteration of the Player's Handbook in favor of newer, fresher ideas, it was cries of 'blasphemy'. Looking at the content released by Wizards in the form of Published adventures, core rulebooks, and (especially) the Insider resources, I have huge trust that Wizards will bring back those old, beloved classes in a new, interesting, fun, playable, and unique capacity.

As for Swordmage, I would mind it being reprinted in the PHB2 at all. Infact, I would praise Wizards for doing so. If it was only available to FRPG purchasers, the broader demographic of non-Forgotten Realms players would feel cheated out of having the class. And to those who purchase both: you'll really feel cheated because one class out of eight new classes in a book full of new class/race/misc-player-content will have been reprinted, thereby voiding the validity of your purchase?

-IV

 

[thundershot]

Not the original poster, but here's a summary of what we know so far.

All new classes will appear in either a PH or a PG, after which they'll be expanded upon in a splatbook. Knowing the bard and sorcerer and swordmage will all appear in Arcane Power tells us that those classes must appear in either the PH2, FRPG, or both. Rich Baker has said there will be exactly one new class in the FRPG, the swordmage, and that the swordmage will not be duplicated in the PH2. That gives us all the information we need to conclude that the bard and sorcerer must appear in the PH2.

Mike Mearls previously gave us the first letters of all eight PH2 classes: B, B, D, I, S, S, T, W. Based on this new information plus what Wizards has previously confirmed, that gives us:

B arbarian - primal striker or controller
B ard - arcane leader
D ruid - primal non-leader, possibly a hybrid role
I ?
S haman - primal leader
S orcerer - arcane controller
T ?
W ?

What do we know or at least suspect about the final three? Well, Andy Collins has mentioned a divine controller in the PH2 who uses flame strike and the like on foes, and it's certainly possible such a character could be called the theurge (or perhaps thaumaturgist). Some of the RPGAers have talked about a potential primal controller called the witch, though I don't believe any of the designers have officially mentioned such a class yet. And as to the "I" class, it's worth noting that the divine splatbook will make its debut before the PH3, which means the final PH2 class is very likely divine. A couple of the designers have talked about a completely-new-to-D&D striker making its debut in the PH2 -- perhaps it could be a divine Inquisitor? That's only a guess, but a reasonable one, based on the evidence to date.

Also, don't forget that we were told that there would be three NEVER BEFORE SEEN classes in PHB2. Look at that... there's three we don't know yet.... A logical guess is that two of them are divine, and one of them primal.

If they did that, then the first four power sources would each have 4 classes dedicated to them.

MARTIAL
Fighter, Warlord, Ranger, Rogue
ARCANE
Wizard, Warlock, Bard, Sorcerer
DIVINE
Cleric, Paladin, *NEW*, *NEW*
PRIMAL
Barbarian, Druid, Shaman, *NEW*


Just an observation, and I'm not counting setting specific classes like Swordmage and Artificer...

 

[Rechan]

What I REALLY want to see in PHB2 is the return of "subsidiaries". Familiars, Animal Companions, Followers, Cohorts, Paladin Mounts, etc...

I suspect you'll actually see that stuff in the various Power Sourcebooks.

In fact, I seem to recall a blurb somewhere about Martial Power having animal companions.

Although cohorts/followers seem like a good filler for DMG2.