Re: Magic item pricing
Haste the spell vs continual haste in an item is a considerably different beast. Haste the spell is limited in power mostly by its very short duration (1 rd/lvl). There are a number of spells that are similarly balanced if used only as restricted in the spell, but become totaly broken if you permit them to be placed in a constant use item (True Strike most obviously, but also any of the cure spells), since as a constant use item their power becomes vastly greater.
The principle is similar to using monsters as PC, leading to the +CL system, since most monsters don't even survive one encounter, any abilities they have are likely to only get used once. Where as if you have a PC who will most likely survive the encounter the ability to do X at will becomes vastly more powerful.
Yes you are technically correct in that you can do a continual haste item as only about 30k and your analysis is probably correct as to how the "original" price modifier was arrived at. However, any DM who permits such an item at that kind of a price is clearly a moron, given the spell's benefits.
Furthermore, I would point out that the speed abillity for a weapon, which only grants an additional attack (not even an additional standard action) and no AC bonus, is rated as a +4 ability, which would strongly indicate that as a +3 ability the speed armor power is seriously underpriced.
The GMW quiver is not even vaguely as abusive. First off the spell lasts for hours and affects a substantial number of Arrows each time it is cast. So the effective difference between having it only go off a couple of times a day (say 2-4 times) and having it continually active is almost negligable (an extended GMW from a 12th level caster does last all day), furthermore the cost is considerably increased by the probable desire to have it be at a much higher than minimum caster level to increase the + of the GMW arrows. I believe the price you quoted earlier for a +5 GMW quiver at just shy of 100,000 gp, hardly an insigificant sum of cash, even for a very high level character.
Finally such a quiver, arguably is the difference between a high level archer being utterly ineffective and being equivalent to other characters of that level. Speed armor serve no such similar need.
mkletch said:
Haste the spell vs continual haste in an item is a considerably different beast. Haste the spell is limited in power mostly by its very short duration (1 rd/lvl). There are a number of spells that are similarly balanced if used only as restricted in the spell, but become totaly broken if you permit them to be placed in a constant use item (True Strike most obviously, but also any of the cure spells), since as a constant use item their power becomes vastly greater.
The principle is similar to using monsters as PC, leading to the +CL system, since most monsters don't even survive one encounter, any abilities they have are likely to only get used once. Where as if you have a PC who will most likely survive the encounter the ability to do X at will becomes vastly more powerful.
Yes you are technically correct in that you can do a continual haste item as only about 30k and your analysis is probably correct as to how the "original" price modifier was arrived at. However, any DM who permits such an item at that kind of a price is clearly a moron, given the spell's benefits.
Furthermore, I would point out that the speed abillity for a weapon, which only grants an additional attack (not even an additional standard action) and no AC bonus, is rated as a +4 ability, which would strongly indicate that as a +3 ability the speed armor power is seriously underpriced.
The GMW quiver is not even vaguely as abusive. First off the spell lasts for hours and affects a substantial number of Arrows each time it is cast. So the effective difference between having it only go off a couple of times a day (say 2-4 times) and having it continually active is almost negligable (an extended GMW from a 12th level caster does last all day), furthermore the cost is considerably increased by the probable desire to have it be at a much higher than minimum caster level to increase the + of the GMW arrows. I believe the price you quoted earlier for a +5 GMW quiver at just shy of 100,000 gp, hardly an insigificant sum of cash, even for a very high level character.
Finally such a quiver, arguably is the difference between a high level archer being utterly ineffective and being equivalent to other characters of that level. Speed armor serve no such similar need.
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