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Psions, underpowered? Your experience?
- Thread starter The Souljourner
- Start date
(Psi)SeveredHead
Adventurer
I take it that you haven't come across many traps...
No matter how high your Search skill is, you aren't able to find traps with a DC over 20.
Actually, Bruce Cordell said that a savant can search for traps like a rogue. The best place to find Bruce is at www.montecook.com, go to the psionics forum.
Well, combat is a fact of life in Dungeons and Dragons.
Any psion can be good at combat, actually.
A nomad could use Metaphysical Weapon, a sling, and bullets. There: +6 to hit and damage. They can also use Spiderclimb or other movement powers to scout ahead.
No matter how high your Search skill is, you aren't able to find traps with a DC over 20.
Actually, Bruce Cordell said that a savant can search for traps like a rogue. The best place to find Bruce is at www.montecook.com, go to the psionics forum.
Well, combat is a fact of life in Dungeons and Dragons.
Any psion can be good at combat, actually.
A nomad could use Metaphysical Weapon, a sling, and bullets. There: +6 to hit and damage. They can also use Spiderclimb or other movement powers to scout ahead.
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Mahiro Satsu
First Post
You guys (and Gals, sorry) have shown me the uses for Psionics, but why do they have to be such a freakin complex system? Couldnt there be a way to make it more compatable with 3e?
(Psi)SeveredHead
Adventurer
I think you meant Lesser Metaphysical Weapon, Zhure.
Anyway, my 1st level cleric (in another campaign) used Magic Weapon for the same purpose. Not that the other PCs ever missed, but they got were able to confirm criticals a lot more often
About damage-dealing, if anyone has ideas about non-damage dealing psychokinetic powers, please post them here (I'll credit you) or at the Mind's Eye messageboard at WotC (in the Here's Your Chance thread). The savant is still looking for a purpose...
I didn't find the Psionics system so complicated (except figuring out # of power points, I had to write a special chart just for that).
If you see some repetition here, sorry. My computer is really messing up today.
Anyway, my 1st level cleric (in another campaign) used Magic Weapon for the same purpose. Not that the other PCs ever missed, but they got were able to confirm criticals a lot more often
About damage-dealing, if anyone has ideas about non-damage dealing psychokinetic powers, please post them here (I'll credit you) or at the Mind's Eye messageboard at WotC (in the Here's Your Chance thread). The savant is still looking for a purpose...
I didn't find the Psionics system so complicated (except figuring out # of power points, I had to write a special chart just for that).
If you see some repetition here, sorry. My computer is really messing up today.
Zhure
First Post
(Psi)SeveredHead said:I think you meant Lesser Metaphysical Weapon, Zhure.
Anyway, my 1st level cleric (in another campaign) used Magic Weapon for the same purpose. Not that the other PCs ever missed, but they got were able to confirm criticals a lot more often
You're correct, I meant Lesser Metaphysical Weapon. The advantage the psion has is it lasts 1 hr/level rather than 1 minute as the divine/arcane version does.
As pointed out earlier, anyone who plays a psion as a sorcerer will be disatisfied. They have their own unique play strategy, based on their specialty. Psions also blend well with non-casters. A half-orc Egoist/Barbarian wearing medium armor all buffed up by powers then Raging deals out huge amounts of melee damage; probably enough to make a fighter wince.
Egoists (Str) only seem like fighters when they are hanging out with wizards and sorcerers. Run them like a monk and they do ok. They have a bad BAB progression, but make it up by having access to a lot of long-duration buffing and some healing. Using Claws of the Vampire and Improved Biofeedback means you're healing back 4d8 hit points a round (2 hits @ 1d8 each, plus you heal the subdual AND real damage at the same time).
Savants (Con) are tough little buggers. Concentrate on rogue-type skills and powers and they can sub for a tough rogue. d4's for hit points isn't so great, but they always have good Con. They are also as close
Nomads (Dex) are also very rogue-like and serve as awesome scouts. Best AC's among the psions and also the best range weapon users. They make excellent archers.
Shapers (Int) the premier summoner in the D&D world, unless one uses PrCs. They can custom build a summoned construct (with a hefty pile of immunities, including to illusions) that isn't stopped by a magic circle. Incarnate is the bad-asterisk version of Permanency.
Seers (Wis) while the weakest of the psions, the Seer has some really key powers, like Emulate Power.
Telepaths (Cha) are among the most powerful of all "caster" classes. They get some powers at a better level than do sorcerers.
Shard O'Glase
First Post
Zhure said:
Not really. You can custom make a construct with a small list of abilities, the not being stopped by magic circles is nice though. But, the summon monster list is so varied you easily have monsters for any occasion, and plenty of occasions constructs can't deal with, like tunneling who the heck forgot to add tunneling to the list yeesh. Add in the huge spellcasting power of the later summons and the long duration summons the calling planar whatever spell make it so the wiz/sor/clerics/your neighbors dog pimp slap the shaper in summoning. I think the shapers summoning is cooler and style points earn a lot when I'm making characters. Incanate does rock by the way.
psion experience
I once played a 3e psion. A dwarven Savant. I loved him! Perfectly pissy like a dwarf on a ship should be, and can clean up the orc hordes with his cone of sound. The game only lasted till i was 5th level or so, so I didnt have high level experience, but I think it was a good choice. If you make your character interesting and your DM realizes that you're ineffective in combat after your points are gone (and thus gives you more RP and less combat) you'll have a blast.
I once played a 3e psion. A dwarven Savant. I loved him! Perfectly pissy like a dwarf on a ship should be, and can clean up the orc hordes with his cone of sound. The game only lasted till i was 5th level or so, so I didnt have high level experience, but I think it was a good choice. If you make your character interesting and your DM realizes that you're ineffective in combat after your points are gone (and thus gives you more RP and less combat) you'll have a blast.
Michael Tree
First Post
What level of character are you considering? At lower levels psions have limited usefulness, but I've seen mid to high level psions used for tremendous effect. A high level Telepath with mind switch, metamorphosis, mass domination, and the Body Fuel feat is a horrifying foe (trust me, I've played one ). There's virtually no limit to the havoc he can create, and if he faces undead or constructs, he can just polymorph into a stone giant, manifest haste, inertial barrier, and tenser's transformation (with no expensive material component to worry about) and wade into combat. That is, if he doesn't just want to send in the minions he dominated or charmed a few days ago to do the fighting. My Telepath also used the psicrystal Channel Power ability to tremendously good use.
My advice for playing a worthwhile psion is:
- Get If Thoughts Could Kill. This book single-handedly makes psions worthwhile, giving psions more power points, less dependancy on multiple stats, and a broader variety of powers to choose from, including many great wizard spells.
- Use the errata. Displays are obnoxious otherwise.
- Use the Wizards website. There are many cool powers and feats there. Always take Resculpt Mind, or better yet, turn it into a class ability as many have done.
- Don't bother taking any damage-dealing powers. They suck wet farts out of dead pidgeons. Instead, take indirect powers and attacks, like astral constructs and telepathic powers. (If you plan on taking any high level Astral Construct powers, learn Ecto Puppet and get the Trigger Power feat to create them for free as a standard action.)
- Make sure you are able to manifest at least 2nd level metabolic powers. Animal Affinity is tremendously useful, as is body adjustment. If you can swing it, take Polymorph Self as a 4th level power or Metamorphosis as a 5th. Psionics doesn't require any components, so a psion could polymorph himself into a sparrow (for flight and incredible size and Dex bonuses to AC), a rock (for ubiquitousness and unobtrusiveness) or a girallon or stone giant (for sheer physical power) and still manifest powers freely.
- Use the house rules that make Hide Power into a single feat, and that give the psion the Chain Link or Upgrade Power feats as a class ability.
- Take a single level of Bruce Cordell's variant/upgraded Slayer that's on Monte Cook's website and the print version of ITCK. That way you gain proficiency in all armor and shields without losing a level of power progression. (Yes this is twinkery, but not unjustified twinkery. )
- At the earliest opportunity, get a mind feeder weapon. Even if you never use it in combat, and only use it to coup de gras helpless opponents, it's worth whatever you had to do to get it. A Torc of Psionc Might is almost as useful.
- If you're playing a higher level Telepath, only take the 'Mass' versions of your powers. Mass Suggestion and Mass Domination cost less than half the PPs of the lower level versions, have much higher save DCs, affect 1 target/level, and in the case of Domination, have the additional perk that no common language is neccessary. (If you are lower level, take the Chain Link feat and upgrade as soon as gain access to the appropriate level of powers).
). There's virtually no limit to the havoc he can create, and if he faces undead or constructs, he can just polymorph into a stone giant, manifest haste, inertial barrier, and tenser's transformation (with no expensive material component to worry about) and wade into combat. That is, if he doesn't just want to send in the minions he dominated or charmed a few days ago to do the fighting. My Telepath also used the psicrystal Channel Power ability to tremendously good use.My advice for playing a worthwhile psion is:
- Get If Thoughts Could Kill. This book single-handedly makes psions worthwhile, giving psions more power points, less dependancy on multiple stats, and a broader variety of powers to choose from, including many great wizard spells.
- Use the errata. Displays are obnoxious otherwise.
- Use the Wizards website. There are many cool powers and feats there. Always take Resculpt Mind, or better yet, turn it into a class ability as many have done.
- Don't bother taking any damage-dealing powers. They suck wet farts out of dead pidgeons. Instead, take indirect powers and attacks, like astral constructs and telepathic powers. (If you plan on taking any high level Astral Construct powers, learn Ecto Puppet and get the Trigger Power feat to create them for free as a standard action.)
- Make sure you are able to manifest at least 2nd level metabolic powers. Animal Affinity is tremendously useful, as is body adjustment. If you can swing it, take Polymorph Self as a 4th level power or Metamorphosis as a 5th. Psionics doesn't require any components, so a psion could polymorph himself into a sparrow (for flight and incredible size and Dex bonuses to AC), a rock (for ubiquitousness and unobtrusiveness) or a girallon or stone giant (for sheer physical power) and still manifest powers freely.
- Use the house rules that make Hide Power into a single feat, and that give the psion the Chain Link or Upgrade Power feats as a class ability.
- Take a single level of Bruce Cordell's variant/upgraded Slayer that's on Monte Cook's website and the print version of ITCK. That way you gain proficiency in all armor and shields without losing a level of power progression. (Yes this is twinkery, but not unjustified twinkery.
)- At the earliest opportunity, get a mind feeder weapon. Even if you never use it in combat, and only use it to coup de gras helpless opponents, it's worth whatever you had to do to get it. A Torc of Psionc Might is almost as useful.
- If you're playing a higher level Telepath, only take the 'Mass' versions of your powers. Mass Suggestion and Mass Domination cost less than half the PPs of the lower level versions, have much higher save DCs, affect 1 target/level, and in the case of Domination, have the additional perk that no common language is neccessary. (If you are lower level, take the Chain Link feat and upgrade as soon as gain access to the appropriate level of powers).
What's so complex about it? Powers use the same basic rules as spellcasting. Only psionic combat is complicated, and it's almost universally agreed that it's worse than useless, so you can just dump it if you want.Mahiro Satsu said:
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