Pulling out someone elses weapon.

[Magic Rub]

Could they try to cut his belt & take the swords, scabbard and all?
Maybe his pants will fall down as a bonus (or not) ?

 

[ForceUser]

Okay, we have a 2nd level Fighter with a longspear and we have 3 1st level Goblin Rogues. The goblins try to tumble to avoid the AO from the longspear, they make it. They know that the Fighter will cut them down if he can pull out his two weapons (amb/twf) so they try to pull them out instead.

1. Touch attack and pickpocket?
2. Pure pickpocket?
3. Something else?

I lean towards pure pickpocket since you don't need to make a touch attack to normally do pickpocket, but that's not in combat so I'm not sure.

I'd rule that they'd have to initiate a grapple. If they did, they could make an opposed Strength check on the following round to pull the weapon from it's sheath. Doing so would open them to an AoO and would also end the grapple.

I don't have my PHB handy, but I'd look into the rule for disarming a foe as well. That's basically what you're doing.

 

[Macbrea]

Yes, they could make a "Strike an Object attack" vs the fighters belt. I am guessing it would be Hardness 1, Hps 1 As 1 inch of hemp rope is Hardness 0, Hps 2. Cutting it would of course have the effects of removing the belt from them.


Historically, most belts didn't hold up your pants but held onto your pockets (pouches). You normally wear pants (with draw string), Tunic which goes to middle of upper thigh muscle, and belt over the tunic to hold on weapons and belt pouches.




Just random thoughts,

 

[Lord Ben]

Lifting a money-bag and lifting a dagger at the ready shouldn't be any different. If a pickpocket can lift things securely held in inner pockets, etc. I think it could also draw a weapon out of another persons sheath. DC20 to lift a small object from someone without them noticing, and the Goblin really doesn't care that it's noticed, he just wants to grab it. Disarming, grapple, etc all favor the fighter and take size into account. A weapon in a sheath is made to be able to be drawn without hassle, I don't see why a goblin would have such a hard time yanking it out.

 

[Macbrea]

I would think the ability to defend ones self against a group trying to mug you would favor the fighter.

Might just be me but I like the idea of a warriorish type being able to defend his weapon better then a rogue.

 

[Magic Rub]

Cut the belt, cut the belt! That way if you don't get the swords away from the fighter, he'll still have to stop & pick them up, or take some time to draw them because they're no longer mounted corectly for drawing. Maybe granting an AoO, or a -X to his AC. Or his gold pouches may fall to the ground, as per Macbrea post.

 

[IceBear]

I wouldn't use pickpocket for this. Pickpocket is for taking something off of someone without their notice. If you want to use this skill give them a high bonus because they don't care if they're seen.

IceBear

 

[Lord Ben]

Well, the fighter has a reach weapon and quick draw. He always gets the AO's and then doesn't suffer at all when they get up close by needing a MEA to unsheath. I just wanted to put in a penalty of some sort and have the goblins use some decent tactics. How many times in the movie does the goodguy quickly pull the gun out of the badguys belt?

Disarming is pulling it from their hand, that's a bit different. If any class can tumble past a longspear and pull his readied shortsword away a rogue or monk would be MUCH better at that then a fighter would.

I like pickpocket because it's really a skill of taking unattended things off people's body. Whether it's a coin in a purse or a sword in a sheath that only modifies the DC, not the skill used. And the Goblin isn't trying to do it unnoticed either, just yank it away.

 

[kreynolds]

I like pickpocket because it's really a skill of taking unattended things off people's body.

EDIT: Deleted first paragraph. I got caught up in semantics. Doh!

I think Pick Pocket is appropriate for this situation, so long as the weapon is a small item. I don't know about any of you guys, but I won't let a goblin Pick Pocket your Greatsword from you, but maybe that's just me. Anyways, just handle pick pocket like normal, but with a +10 circumstance penalty for a total of DC30. I have a feeling that pick pocketing someone while in the middle of an all-out brawl just might be a bit of a pain in the arse.

The only thing your little goblin has to worry about is that pissed off fighter looming over him when it's the fighter's turn.

 

[kreynolds]

Pickpocket is for taking something off of someone without their notice.

Not entirely true. Just because you are being observed doesn't mean that you can't use pick pocket. In fact, the DC doesn't go up because you are being observed until your second attempt, after your first attempt fails. Also, the target spoting you doesn't cause you to fail, they simply notice you ripping them off. The DC to take something from someone has a base of DC20, and I think that fighting should add at least 10, for a total of 30. You might even go higher than that. Tough to say.