question about character total value.

[CRGreathouse]

Well, that section says that self-created items are 70% MORE expensive than regular items.

70% as expensive, not 70% more expensive. I'll assume this is a simple translation issue...

The reason it's 70% and not 50% is that the book assumes you'll just choose a level for an NPC regardless of XP spent, so it gives either a 20% premium on the XP you would have otherwise lost, or a 30% discount for having the required feats, depending on how you want to look at it.

 

[Nail]

Making your own items costs you in two ways, don't forget. Aside from the experience points, there's also the feats you have to use on item creation feats instead of feats you could use during an adventure. Still, especially for Wizards, it's a very effective system.

If you're making the items for yourself, that is. In an actual long-term campaign, working your way from first to twentieth, a Wizard who spends her downtime cranking out scrolls, potions, wands, and wondrous items to tuck into her own pack

'Course, in my experience, it's th' mages that do th' whinin':

"Ah...guys? I need some protection over here....Guys!? ...they've got sharp pointy sticks and they're poking me!!....Guys!!?...."

:^)

As fer th' feats and what-not, yer probably best off just stickin' with th' only item creation feat that truely matters: Wonderous Item. Put th' rest is spell focus, Imp. Init., Empower spell, etc. An' get th' town alchemist an' scribe ta spend their (DM approved!) Infinite NPC XP Reservoirs(tm) on scrolls, potions, an' wands that 'cha buy. All that truck is temporary...get yer mage ta make stuff that's permanent. It's cheaper per use an' doesn't run out half-way thru th' Crimson Labyrinth of the Amazon Spider Queen.

-Nail

 

[AGGEMAM]

70% as expensive, not 70% more expensive. I'll assume this is a simple translation issue...

The reason it's 70% and not 50% is that the book assumes you'll just choose a level for an NPC regardless of XP spent, so it gives either a 20% premium on the XP you would have otherwise lost, or a 30% discount for having the required feats, depending on how you want to look at it.

Oh yeah...

It was the following sentence that got me confused.

EDIT: But why would you think it was a translation issue.

 

[Nail]

Fer some reason or another I did a bit more number crunchin':

2 Mages at 10th level, creating characters with 50,000XP and 49,000 gp (as per DMG)

One (mage #1) spends no XP on making magic items himself. So his equipment book value is: 49.000 gp.

Th' other (mage #2) spends all of his cash (49,000gp) and the necessary XP (1960 XP) to create magic items. When finished his book value is 98,000 gp, i.e. double what mage #1 has.

But mage #2 has an XP deficit of 1960 XP compared to mage#1. If a typical 10th level encounter gives him 714 XP, that means has has ta go thru about 3 encounters more than mage #1 to get to the next level.

Or, each mage has to get thru:

Mage#1(miser) ===> seven EL 10,
Mage#2(spender) => ten EL 10,

encounters ta get to 11th level.

Who gets there quickest/easiest/with least blood-loss?

Are they "equal" characters?

Interestin'.

-Nail

 

[Artoomis]

Okay, Nail, if we assume your two mages are equal (well, theoretically they are, right?), then you see why you have to use 1/2 book value for created items to failry compare the two power levels.

 

[Nail]

Okay, Nail, if we assume your two mages are equal (well, theoretically they are, right?

Actually, that is th' question that interests me. At the instant of character generation, the answers obviously no. More magic items at any given level equals more power. But over time? Does the magic-making-mage win out? What's the cut=off? Etc, etc, etc.

-Nail

 

[Artoomis]

Theoretically, the power level is the same because of the experience cost involved. I say theoretically, because that seems to be what the the wealth per level chart is based on.

In practice, it depends greatly on the campaign.

If you level up quickly, then by all means spend every gp creating you own items.

If you level slowly, then every experience point is extremely valuable.

It depends on the value you put to leveling up along with everyone else, or doing so more slowly. If you have folks in the party with the multi-class 20% penalty, then all the more reason to go for it and create items - you won't level up as slowly as they do. (I'm assuming you wouldn't get all your wealth in cash - else, as you pointed out, there is some diminishing returns at higher levels)