Question on Flame Blade...

[Black Knight Irios]

Why not? The effect here are not stacking and this is not a touch spell

I think it has nothing to do with Range:touch at all, Bear's Endurance, Mass isn't touch but what is the benefit of having the spell twice cast on you, anyway. What use is it casting Mage Armor twice on you either, there is no gain, you could probably rule, that since you have two hands you can employ that spell twice but with the normal penalties for Two-Weapon Fighting, I think that would not make the spell too good and I wouldn't mind either, I would probably let players in my campaign use the spell in that manner, too.

 

[James McMurray]

Empowered, 9th level caster: 4th level slot for 1d8+4 * 1.5 damage per hit (average 12.75, minimum 7, maximum 18)

Maximized, 9th level caster: 5th level slot for 12 damage per hit.

As is usual with spells whose random portion includes a level dependent adder, you are better off empowering the spell instead of maximizing.

 

[DarkMaster]

I think it has nothing to do with Range:touch at all, Bear's Endurance, Mass isn't touch but what is the benefit of having the spell twice cast on you, anyway. What use is it casting Mage Armor twice on you either, there is no gain, you could probably rule, that since you have two hands you can employ that spell twice but with the normal penalties for Two-Weapon Fighting, I think that would not make the spell too good and I wouldn't mind either, I would probably let players in my campaign use the spell in that manner, too.

Well all the spell you are referring would stack (Bear Endurance and armor) and touch spell is a matter because you cannot have two touch spell charged at the same time.

 

[James McMurray]

They would stack with one another but not with themselves.

I look at it more like 3.0 Shield. You couldn't cast it twice in order to get +7 AC against the entire battlefield, because it wouldn't stack with itself, even if oriented differently.

 

[DarkMaster]

They would stack with one another but not with themselves.

I look at it more like 3.0 Shield. You couldn't cast it twice in order to get +7 AC against the entire battlefield, because it wouldn't stack with itself, even if oriented differently.

Sorry I never played 3.0, I guess the 3.5 version corrected that problem by stating "in front of you".
If I follow your reasoning I could not create two swords at the same time with the spell major creation because their effect would stack??

 

[James McMurray]

3.5 shield changed to be 360 degree coverage.

Nope, one creates an actual item that can be passed around. The other creates a spell effect with a0' range.

But my primary reasoning is "because I don't think its balanced." Everything else is just window dressing, without which my ruling for my game) ill still exist.

 

[jgsugden]

Actually, a maximized or empowered flame blade would deal no damage.

You'd spend too much time explaining to your allies why you were using the flame blade instead of wildshaping for you to actually get an attack in with it ...

 

[Sejs]

1) Yes, it has a numeric variable, therefor it can be maximized.

2) It doesn't require concentration to maintain, only occupies one hand, and doesn't require you to hold the charge ala shocking grasp. I would say yes, you could create and maintain 2 flame blades at a time - one for each hand. If you wanted to cast anything else after that, however, the spell would have to be either Still, or not require somatic components as you would no longer have any hands free.

3) No, you cannot hand a flame blade off to someone else. It's a bar of fire - there's nothing to hand off.

4) 5th level spells. Spell level 2 +3 for Maximize. Druids must be caster level 9 in order to cast 5th level spells. Frankly, your 5th level spell slots could be better utilized with other things than a maximized flame blade.

5) Yes, it's treated as a scimitar (18-20/x2). A crit with a maximized flame blade at caster level 9 would do (8+4=12x2=24) 24 points of fire damage.

 

[jgsugden]

Hmmmm ... produce flame lasts shorter, but the average damage is higher for a few levels:

Level 1: d6+1 vs --
Level 2: d6+2 vs --
Level 3: d6+3 (6.5) vs d8+1 (5.5)
Level 4: d6+4 (7.5) vs d8+2 (6.5)
Level 5: d6+5 (8.5) vs d8+2 (6.5)
Level 6/7: d6+5 (8.5) vs d8+3 (7.5)
Level 8/9: d6+5 (8.5) vs d8+4 (8.5)

It is not until 10th level that you deal more damage with flame blade. The flame blade is around longer, but the produce flame is a missile weapon as well as a melee weapon and can be delivered. In addition, it is unclear that produce flame will not deliver its flame damage when you deliver a claw or slam attack when in wild shaped form ... (as touch spells may normally be delivered in this fashion).

 

[Darklone]

Empowered Flameblade? I'd rather use the good old Flame Strike