D&D 5E Question using Spell Points variant rule in Sorcerer

[ScuroNotte]

Playing a Sorcerer using the variant Spell Points instead of spell slots.

Question: Are the Sorcery Points combined with Spell Points?

 

[Croesus]

That's how my group is running it - spell points and sorcery points add together into a single pool of points. It does give the sorcerer some additional flexibility for using metamagic, but it hasn't been overpowered at all. It also simplifies the character a bit, as I only have to track a single pool, instead of two separate pools.

 

[Fanaelialae]

By RAW, no.

But if I were to use spell points, I'd allow it. It's a moderate boost in power (since you can trade them back and forth at full value, without using actions) but I can't see it being too overpowered and it would certainly make things simpler to track.

 

[ScuroNotte]

That's how my group is running it - spell points and sorcery points add together into a single pool of points. It does give the sorcerer some additional flexibility for using metamagic, but it hasn't been overpowered at all. It also simplifies the character a bit, as I only have to track a single pool, instead of two separate pools.

Thanks for input. Good to know it doesn't make it OP.

Another question. Since you are currently using it, do you plan to allow the Sorcerer to create a 2nd 6th and 7th level spell at the appropriate levels or leave the restriction of 1 spell at level 6 and 7 per long rest. We are starting a new campaign at 15th level.

 

[ScuroNotte]

By RAW, no.

But if I were to use spell points, I'd allow it. It's a moderate boost in power (since you can trade them back and forth at full value, without using actions) but I can't see it being too overpowered and it would certainly make things simpler to track.

Thank you for your help.

BTW. Is it written you can't or is it because the spell point option is in the DMG and not a PHB?

 

[Fanaelialae]

Is it written you can't or is it because the spell point option is in the DMG and not a PHB?

It's not RAW because they're two separate pools. If the designers had intended for it to work that way, it would have likely been noted in the rules for Spell Points in the DMG. Besides, lumping them together gives sorcerers a significant advantage over sorcerers not using the spell point variant (not that you'd use both in the same campaign, but the variant isn't meant to give specifically sorcerers a boost in power).

By RAW, if you want to gain one sorcery point, it would cost 2 spell points and a bonus action. If you wanted to gain five sorcery points, it would cost 7 spell points and a bonus action.

You also couldn't convert sorcery points into spell points, but you still could create spell slots with sorcery points (also as a bonus action) which you could use to cast spells. Note that even when using the spell point variant, you don't directly expend spell points to cast spells, but rather you expend spell points to create spell slots, which you then use to cast spells.

It's not that it's written that you can't, but rather that it isn't written that you can.

 

[ScuroNotte]

It's not RAW because they're two separate pools. If the designers had intended for it to work that way, it would have likely been noted in the rules for Spell Points in the DMG. Besides, lumping them together gives sorcerers a significant advantage over sorcerers not using the spell point variant (not that you'd use both in the same campaign, but the variant isn't meant to give specifically sorcerers a boost in power).

By RAW, if you want to gain one sorcery point, it would cost 2 spell points and a bonus action. If you wanted to gain five sorcery points, it would cost 7 spell points and a bonus action.

You also couldn't convert sorcery points into spell points, but you still could create spell slots with them which you could cast spells (also as a bonus action). Note that even when using the spell point variant, you don't directly expend spell points to cast spells, but rather you expend spell points to create spell slots, which you then use to cast spells.

It's not that it's written that you can't, but rather that it isn't written that you can.

Is it then more "balanced" to do as you mentioned ie 7 spell points for for 5 sorcery points, or is the difference minimal in the course of the game?

 

[Fanaelialae]

Is it then more "balanced" to do as you mentioned ie 7 spell points for for 5 sorcery points, or is the difference minimal in the course of the game?

That's honestly a matter of opinion.

If we assume that the designers nailed the balance perfectly, then the RAW approach is more balanced.

If you believe that sorcerers are a bit under powered (some people do, although having played multiple spellcasters including two sorcerers, I can't say I'm one of them) then the alternate way is likely fine.

If you're like me and you prefer simplicity over hardcore balance, then you might prefer the latter as well. Lumping them together means significantly less bookkeeping.

Admittedly though, I've never tried it. It's just something I've strongly considered IF I ever decide to use the Spell Points variant. I don't think it would be horribly broken. I expect the difference would be reasonably minimal. But, it's possible that I'm wrong. The only way to know with reasonable certainty would be extensive playtesting.

 

[ScuroNotte]

That's how my group is running it - spell points and sorcery points add together into a single pool of points. It does give the sorcerer some additional flexibility for using metamagic, but it hasn't been overpowered at all. It also simplifies the character a bit, as I only have to track a single pool, instead of two separate pools.

Forgot to ask what level is the Sorcerer in your campaign?

 

[Croesus]

Another question. Since you are currently using it, do you plan to allow the Sorcerer to create a 2nd 6th and 7th level spell at the appropriate levels or leave the restriction of 1 spell at level 6 and 7 per long rest. We are starting a new campaign at 15th level.

For simplicity, we allow a sorcerer to cast 2 spells of levels 6 and 7, and only 1 spell of levels 8 and 9, so long as he has spell slots of those levels. It's a bit easier than the spell slot matrix, which only allows 2 level 6 spells at caster level 19 and 2 level 7 spells at caster level 20. If we find it's overpowered, we'll dial it back. We most definitely don't allow multiple 8th/9th level spells per day.

My sorcerer just reached 9th level. We decided to try spell points for sorcerers to make them play differently from wizards. The RAW sorcerer just seemed too much like a wizard with metamagic. By using spell points, it really emphasizes that the sorcerer is about casting flexibility, while the wizard is about knowing tons of spells.