Racism, sexism, homophobia, jerkism

[Bullgrit]

I’m wondering . . .

Bullies and bullying.

It used to be the thinking that a person was picked on and bullied because they, the victim, were at fault. The bully picks on you because you are skinny, fat, a nerd, wear glasses, stutter, or were just generally in some way not “normal.” Basically, it was the victim’s fault for being picked on. Advertisements and entertainment showed someone being picked on because of some “weakness” on their part, but when they overcame that weakness, they could show up the bully. The cliché of the skinny boy getting sand kicked in his face, until he worked out and got strong. Or the nerdy girl who’s snubbed by everyone until she sheds the glasses and puts on makeup.

In recent years, society has turned this around from telling the victim to “man up” and become “better,” to pointing to the bully and calling him out as a jerk. We’re now telling the bully to straighten up and act right to other people. There are “stop bullying” initiatives in schools all over the US. We now tell folks with “weaknesses” that the torment is not because of them, it’s because that person mistreating them is a bully jerk. I think this is a better way.

But it seems that this idea stops short of certain particular types of bullying. For instance, (but not limited to), racism, sexism, homophobia. It seems that society still says, “this person is treating you badly because of you.” That is, you’re getting poor treatment because you’re black. Or your thoughts are dismissed because you’re a woman. Or you were called names because you’re gay.

As a straight, white, man, when I’m poorly treated by someone, (and believe it or not, it does happen sometimes), I just label the offender as an . He’s bullying me because *he* is a jerk. I don’t think, “he’s bullying me because *I’m* something.” But then I’m not living in a society that constantly tells me that bad things happen to me because I’m something.

Of course, no one expects the victim of racism/sexism/homophobia to change in order to end the problem. No one can stop being black, female, or gay. And we still call out the abuser as a racist, sexist, or homophobe. But really, aren’t those people really just bullies and jerks because of who they, themselves, are?

Could racism/sexism/homophobia be better handled by labeling it bullying? Instead of saying, “He mistreated you because you’re Latino,” we could say, “He mistreated you because he’s a friggin’ asshat.”

Does anyone say anymore, “He mistreated you because you’re fat.” Yes, your weight may have been the target of the bullying, but losing weight won’t make the other person any less of a jerk. It’s his personality flaw that is the cause of the problem, not your physical “flaw.”

I’m just thinking around on this – I’m not making any statements that I think are right or wrong. This is just a mental exercise, a philosophical consideration, a subject for discussion here. What do you think?

Are people treated poorly because they are of a different race, the opposite sex, or of a different sexual orientation? Or are people treated poorly because they are confronted by bullies, jerks, and s? Could changing/eliminating racism, sexism, and homophobia be accomplished better by putting them under the general umbrella of “bullying”?

Bullgrit

 

[Ahnehnois]

Causal attribution is an interesting phenomenon. We never know someone else's motivations, so we end up doing a lot of guessing.

Prejudice and bigotry are real, and some groups have it worse than others. However, there is a tendency of those groups to become defensive, and to attribute malice to accidental or meaningless events.

There's something to be said for labeling the aggressor in cases of legitimate malfeasance, rather than the victim. However, it's important to note that a lot of real racism/sexism/etc. is subtle, passive, subconscious, or otherwise not even noticed by the average person. Those attitudes need to be explored more, not grouped under a general "jerk" label.

 

[Umbran]

Of course, no one expects the victim of racism/sexism/homophobia to change in order to end the problem.

Um... well, some do. They're jerks, but they exist.

Could racism/sexism/homophobia be better handled by labeling it bullying?

No. Bullying has a specific goal - to shame, intimidate, or coerce the victim. The point is to inflict certain emotions and feelings in the victim. Some bullying has racism, sexism, or homophobia as a basis.

But, not all incidents of racism, sexism, or homophobia have the goal of intimidation, shaming, or coercion. If a mechanic charges you more for car repairs because of who you are, they aren't bullying you. If the boss doesn't give you a promotion because of your orientation, they aren't bullying you. The perpetrator may not give a fig what you feel about it, but treats you differently.

Basically, discrimination is not the same as bullying.

Instead of saying, “He mistreated you because you’re Latino,” we could say, “He mistreated you because he’s a friggin’ asshat.”

Yes, we could say that. But "asshat" and "bully" are not the same. All bullies are asshats, but not all asshats are bullies, you might say.

 

[Janx]

I would surmise that "we don't server your kind" or calling names at the different colored person as they walked by your porch might be bullying.

But tossing out the resumes with names of a type you don't like? If I hated your kind, as was doing that with my resume stack, you never even enter the picture. I'd certainly be descriminating, but as we had zero interaction, I couldn't call that bullying.


In the current stage of our society correcting its handling of victims and bullies, calling out the bully instead of crapping on the victim is probably currently useful.

But it will likely reach a threshold were like racism, enough of us got the memo, and now "faux-victims" are playing the Race Card to bully their way out of a situation.

Teachers are seeing this now, with more kids saying "it's because I'm black!" when they don't get their way.

One day we'll reach a point where the bad actors will say "You're trying to bully me!" to put someone who is taking a legitimate action on the defensive of not wanting to be labeled a bully.

It's rather like the situation where the person who's complaining that "you're being selfish" is usually saying so because you are giving THEM what THEY want.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

There will always be those who turn legitimate victimizations into weapons.

Yeeeaaaaars ago, when I was a law student, I was in a women's legal issues seminar. One of my fellow students actually felt that problems of false accusations of rape and sexual harrasment were negligible. Since then, crime stats have proven otherwise. While the incidence may be low, the consequences to the falsely accused are long lasting an potentially financially and socially ruinous.

So that someone might falsely or erroneously accuse someone of being a racist, a bully, a sexist, etc. in order to escape responsibility or gain an advantage is not a surprise. Its something humans do.

 

[Janx]

So that someone might falsely or erroneously accuse someone of being a racist, a bully, a sexist, etc. in order to escape responsibility or gain an advantage is not a surprise. Its something humans do.

I think those people are jerks.

And bullies are jerks.

If we had a test to identify the jerks, and ship them to Mars, the Earth might be a better place.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

That would start the War of The Worlds, when the Martians figure out we're using their planet as a "penile" colony.



(See, they violated Wheaton's Law...)

 

[Vyvyan Basterd]

If we had a test to identify the jerks, and ship them to Mars, the Earth might be a better place.

Depends on who created the test. That person would probably end up very lonely here on Earth.

There's an opportunity to teach those exhibiting 'jerk' behavior instead of writing them off. It takes time and patience. And I think we're seeing that education progress. I know the world has improved in this regard since I came into it. I've had points in my life where I overcame learned jerk behavior towards the mentally handicapped, those of other races, and just people in general (Ever sit with a friend and make fun of people passing by?). I know I've learned to be more accepting and less of a jerk. I hope the people I offended in years past can forgive my ignorance. But without that chance to learn I'd be on your proverbial rocketship to Mars.

 

[Ahnehnois]

Yeeeaaaaars ago, when I was a law student, I was in a women's legal issues seminar. One of my fellow students actually felt that problems of false accusations of rape and sexual harrasment were negligible. Since then, crime stats have proven otherwise. While the incidence may be low, the consequences to the falsely accused are long lasting an potentially financially and socially ruinous.

It's worth noting that the damages of even an unsubstantiated accusation can be catastrophic, but false accusations have broader consequences for society. Such accusations diminish the credibility of real victims, and divert law enforcement and healthcare and legal resources away from real problems.

It's important for victim advocates to understand that the liars are not only real, they are committing an offense against the actual victims they are trying to protect.

(Also, I seriously doubt that the incidence is low; though it's almost impossible to know one way or the other).

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Also, I seriously doubt that the incidence is low; though it's almost impossible to know one way or the other.

Since 1996, the FBI has pegged false rape accusations an annual rate of @8%. How accurate that is, I cannot say.