Pathfinder 2E Release Day Second Edition Amazon Sales Rank

[Markh3rd]

I think Paizo relies alot on their adventure path sales. Not so much the stand alone adventure modules(which I've always preferred). I used to play exclusively homebrew with BECMI and AD&D. Lately I prefer canned adventures because I enjoy bringing them to life and seeing how the players react to it, along with the shared experience that comes with it when talking to others about how they experienced it.

 

[teitan]

I think Paizo relies alot on their adventure path sales. Not so much the stand alone adventure modules(which I've always preferred). I used to play exclusively homebrew with BECMI and AD&D. Lately I prefer canned adventures because I enjoy bringing them to life and seeing how the players react to it, along with the shared experience that comes with it when talking to others about how they experienced it.

I totally feel you, I ran TOEE in 2e and Tree Lords, Sunless Citadel but that was about it but these days I don't have a lot of time so my current campaign is the Waterdeep series, Dragon Heist and Mad Mage. I'm having fun but it certainly feels weird.

 

[Parmandur]

Noted.
Do you think Paizo's goals were something to the effect of: within 6 months be selling less Core books than WotC sells modules from 2014?

Probably not, but honestly I doubt they should have been worrying about doing 5E Adventure book numbers. That's pie in the sky stuff.

 

[Markh3rd]

I totally feel you, I ran TOEE in 2e and Tree Lords, Sunless Citadel but that was about it but these days I don't have a lot of time so my current campaign is the Waterdeep series, Dragon Heist and Mad Mage. I'm having fun but it certainly feels weird.

You know, now that I think about it, my running home brew stuff back then had more to do with my age and being broke than by choice. I remember seeing the modules and wishing I could buy them. Wondering what story was inside the covers. Now that I am grown up, I buy them and run them because I can lol. Same thing with owning terrain and having miniatures. I only dreamed of that stuff as a preteen/teenager. So theater of the mind was what we did because its all I had back then.

 

[teitan]

Probably not, but honestly I doubt they should have been worrying about doing 5E Adventure book numbers. That's pie in the sky stuff.

I don't think much of anyone shoots for that, D&D is a bit of a phenomenon right now and most of the growth in the product category IS D&D. There was a time when their current market share was the norm. They have a level of name recognition and exposure that trumps everybody else. Paizo just happened to be able to read the market in 4e and took advantage of that. WOTC knew D&D3.5 needed to be updated, that fans wanted that update and instead they launched a completely new game. Paizo read that market and gave 3.5 players what they wanted and were able to exploit that because most of their developers were WOTC developers in 3.5, they were the magazine editors and they had a finger on the pulse of what D&D players wanted. This time around though 5e was a beast unlike anything seen from D&D since the 80s. As great as 3e sold it has been eclipsed by 5e. Pathfinder fell hard the last couple years. It slipped out of the top 5 and I think that is extremely important when looking at their current sales and their solid number 2 spot at this time. Paizo took a gamble with 2e not being a revision like 3.5 to PF. I think they are planning the long game but it's a long game that may never pay off if WOTC has finally made an evergreen version of the game. They seem to have done just that if the last few years of continuous growth are a fair indicator. It's certainly a breeze to play and teach, probably easier than most board games!

 

[teitan]

You know, now that I think about it, my running home brew stuff back then had more to do with my age and being broke than by choice. I remember seeing the modules and wishing I could buy them. Wondering what story was inside the covers. Now that I am grown up, I buy them and run them because I can lol. Same thing with owning terrain and having miniatures. I only dreamed of that stuff as a preteen/teenager. So theater of the mind was what we did because its all I had back then.

I agree aside from most modules in 2e being subpar, I avoided them because of cash flow and always wanted to try using minis and terrain, especially after Dwarven Forge hit the shelves! So much envy when I watch Critical Role and they drop those set ups on the table. Back in 3e I bought some Hirst Arts molds and tried to make my own but it was such a slow process casting them. Now I have a 3D printer and just need to take time to paint the stuff. Dungeon Tiles are done, doing cavern tiles and then city tiles!

 

[Markh3rd]

I agree aside from most modules in 2e being subpar, I avoided them because of cash flow and always wanted to try using minis and terrain, especially after Dwarven Forge hit the shelves! So much envy when I watch Critical Role and they drop those set ups on the table. Back in 3e I bought some Hirst Arts molds and tried to make my own but it was such a slow process casting them. Now I have a 3D printer and just need to take time to paint the stuff. Dungeon Tiles are done, doing cavern tiles and then city tiles!

Oh man, the stuff you can make with 3D printers is nearly unlimited. I bet you are enjoying that!

 

[teitan]

Oh man, the stuff you can make with 3D printers is nearly unlimited. I bet you are enjoying that!

So far. We have a set of Dungeon tiles almost matching the $90 set of Dwarven Forge terrain and in a couple weeks will have the comparable cavern terrain then we are going to do the dungeon dressing and city tiles. Not a lot of use for Dragon Heist but lots of use for Mad Mage! SHould have the odd stuff printed after the two main sets are done so that we can do odd shaped rooms and corridors.

 

[Hussar]

Noted.
Do you think Paizo's goals were something to the effect of: within 6 months be selling less Core books than WotC sells modules from 2014?

To be perfectly fair though, those 2014 WotC modules are selling better than practically ANYTHING of any edition, other than maybe core books. The idea that a 5 year old module is still anywhere near still selling is unheard of previously. So, comparing anything to how 5e WotC modules are doing is a bit misleading since nothing in the history of the hobby, outside of maybe core books, has had that kind of staying power.

In other words, selling as well as WotC is not the bar anymore. Not when WotC basically tripled the size of the RPG market in the last five or six years. Or, to put it another way, WotC went from the 600 pound gorilla to the 6000 pound gorilla. Which just makes everything else look so much smaller.

 

[teitan]

To be perfectly fair though, those 2014 WotC modules are selling better than practically ANYTHING of any edition, other than maybe core books. The idea that a 5 year old module is still anywhere near still selling is unheard of previously. So, comparing anything to how 5e WotC modules are doing is a bit misleading since nothing in the history of the hobby, outside of maybe core books, has had that kind of staying power.

In other words, selling as well as WotC is not the bar anymore. Not when WotC basically tripled the size of the RPG market in the last five or six years. Or, to put it another way, WotC went from the 600 pound gorilla to the 6000 pound gorilla. Which just makes everything else look so much smaller.

That's what I've been trying to get at. It's insane how well D&D is doing and that's not including merchandising and licensing like the Wizkids minis, T-shirts, comics, new Drizzt novels, pdf sales. It's becoming it's own industry and comparing any game to D&D right now is folly. Comparing D&D to Pathfinder is like comparing Marvel's success to DC's success in cinemas. Its a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation for Paizo just like BvS was a damned if you do, damned if you don't for DC and WB. It's successful but not as successful as hardcore fans would like the DCEU to be in comparison to Marvel. One is a juggernaut and the other has hits & more misses.