D&D 4E Rich Baker on his 4e Warlord

[Plane Sailing]

JMHO, but I don't think any of these abilities were added to the classes and NOT intended to be a part of the class's functinality.

It is a super list, but in all of those instances there is just ONE ability that needs to be 12 in order to get a class bonus.

Doesn't seem like MAD to me, I'm afraid.

 

[Sir Sebastian Hardin]

Karhun’s ability scores are: Str 20, Con 14, Dex 8, Int 17, Wis 10, Cha 14.

I think Ability Scores will be higher in average. Probably with 30+ in point-buy system, or rolling 5d6 and discarding the 2 lowest dice. This could explain Karhun's INSANE stats.

This way, if all classes have skills related to several different abillity scores, they will have enough points to invest in different abillities.

 

[WhatGravitas]

I think Ability Scores will be higher in average. Probably with 30+ in point-buy system, or rolling 5d6 and discarding the 2 lowest dice. This could explain Karhun's INSANE stats.

This way, if all classes have skills related to several different abillity scores, they will have enough points to invest in different abillities.

Or the stats improve more often, like every second level. And perhaps there are some stat-affecting feats.

Cheers, LT.

 

[Naszir]

While the rest of you are arguing about MAD vs. SAD, the thing that really stands out for me is that the Warlord in HEAVY ARMOR is casting wizardly spells. Could the warlord really be effective doing that?? Or have they changed how armor affects spellcasting.

I can “hide” Karhun’s poor Dexterity score by choosing heavy armor for him, so my Armor Class is passable."

I use Karhun’s wizard powers for dealing with foes at range and nifty utility effects ...

 

[Cadfan]

WARNING!!! OVERLY ANALYTICAL SPECULATION ABOUT TO RUSH OFF A CLIFF!!!

He has stats like this:

20, 14, 8, 17, 10, 14

If he started with a 25 point buy, he'd probably have stats like this:

14, 14, 8, 14, 10, 13

That's exactly 10 stat points shy of what he had at level 10. COINCIDENCE???



Seriously, if those are the rules, I'm going to go out on a limb and speculate that there's some cap on how high a stat can be at a given level for a given race.

 

[Gloombunny]

While the rest of you are arguing about MAD vs. SAD, the thing that really stands out for me is that the Warlord in HEAVY ARMOR is casting wizardly spells. Could the warlord really be effective doing that?? Or have they changed how armor affects spellcasting.

Sounds like they changed it, or perhaps just added an "armored spellcasting" feat or feats. Good! As long as there's some sort of tradeoff a wizard has to make, I don't see why armor should be absolutely forbidden to them.

 

[Cadfan]

While the rest of you are arguing about MAD vs. SAD, the thing that really stands out for me is that the Warlord in HEAVY ARMOR is casting wizardly spells. Could the warlord really be effective doing that?? Or have they changed how armor affects spellcasting.

I saw that as well.

The best I can do is speculate.

1) The following might be a little rules intensive, but one thing they could do is set a minimum strength score to wear certain armor (eg, carrying capacity). Then wizards could cast in full plate all day if they wanted, assuming they were strong enough to walk in it.

2) The penalty for casting in armor might manifest itself as a penalty on magic attack rolls. This would be more psychologically bearable than a flat out failure chance, especially if your magic attack rolls are pretty good already.

3) He has magical gear which negates this. I'm sure that mithril is still in D&D in 4e, and there may be choosable class features or feats which lower arcane spell failure.

4) Rich Baker is suffering arcane spell failure, but he doesn't care and didn't mention it. I've never understood why gamers fear arcane spell failure so much, and yet power attack constantly. Maybe he's immune to that effect.

 

[Naszir]

Sounds like they changed it, or perhaps just added an "armored spellcasting" feat or feats. Good! As long as there's some sort of tradeoff a wizard has to make, I don't see why armor should be absolutely forbidden to them.

Armor isn't forbidden it just tends to make them a lot less effective.

 

[DarkKestral]

4) Rich Baker is suffering arcane spell failure, but he doesn't care and didn't mention it. I've never understood why gamers fear arcane spell failure so much, and yet power attack constantly. Maybe he's immune to that effect.

The wizard has to fight armor-less or in a mithril chain shirt to keep from losing his primary class ability (with the exception of any crafting feats, all of his abilities hinge on being able to cast a spell right then and there) to a random chance effect. He spends the ability, but gets no benefit from it, and he has no other way to contribute in combat. So he's basically completely negated, at least past level 5 or so. It is the same for every other arcane casting class.

So the thing is, the classes that are affected by ASF lose out on fun for taking a choice which is already prone to being suboptimal of them, and he's lost a chance to do a cool shtick twice, for no reason. (first, the spell fails, so he's lost an action that can do a cool shtick, then he's lost a spell use, which means his cool shtick use dropped by one. So it's like he's lost 2 actions by a random roll of the die.) This is further punishment, since at high levels, he can always get a mithril chain shirt (0% ASF) enchanted to the same level as the cleric for the same cost. So he's paid an extra 1400 gp to lose an action occasionally and be a lot more prone to being encumbered, for a total of +4 AC, which is a bonus that's usually pretty easy to raise. And if he has a +16 or higher Dex, he'll be Dex-maxed, and can't gain an effect to AC even if he buys a Dex-raising item. (and with a mithril chain shirt, he'll get the benefit of any +6 dex item, so his total AC basically ends up the same...)

 

[Aloïsius]

WARNING!!! OVERLY ANALYTICAL SPECULATION ABOUT TO RUSH OFF A CLIFF!!!

He has stats like this:

20, 14, 8, 17, 10, 14

If he started with a 25 point buy, he'd probably have stats like this:

14, 14, 8, 14, 10, 13

That's exactly 10 stat points shy of what he had at level 10. COINCIDENCE???



Seriously, if those are the rules, I'm going to go out on a limb and speculate that there's some cap on how high a stat can be at a given level for a given race.

Maybe... It would be interesting. But other options exist :
* + x magic item (please, no !)
* different stat generation (random ?).
There is one "20" : that's a 18 + the 2 increase of level 4 and 8.