Rings of Power -- all opinions and spoilers welcome thread.

[FitzTheRuke]

Adjusted for inflation, Jackson's whole trilogy had a $471 million budget for the same runtime.

Fair enough, but I think it could be argued that Jackson went quite a bit further with his budget, in particular when it comes to world-building.

 

[Parmandur]

The details are far more important than the themes, which run in pretty much every fantasy story by any author. HOW Tolkien achieved the friendship, providence, etc. is what makes his version of those themes Tolkien, and which is why the show which completely neglects Tolkien's style fail to be Tolkien in most instances.

In terms of style, the show was more Tolkien Tham any prior adaptation other than the Rankin/Bass specials, IMO. I hope future seasons have montages with people singing songs to each other.

Tolkien changed the details constantly, reading the 22 History of Middle Earth books show that the details were always very, very fungible. The universal themes are the key, the details serve that end. I am genuinely shocked that the sow writers got the ends right, because I rather expetlcred empty reverence for incidental details, as Jackson did.

 

[Parmandur]

Fair enough, but I think it could be argued that Jackson went quite a bit further with his budget, in particular when it comes to world-building.

Eh, mostly what Jackson did was cut the story down, not always intelligently, and storyboard what was left. And certainly those films were a spectacle, but I am utterly baffled that anyone could watch the Rings of Poeer and not see that it on the same plane in terms of craft.

 

[Maxperson]

In terms of style, the show was more Tolkien Tham any prior adaptation other than the Rankin/Bass specials, IMO. I hope future seasons have montages with people singing songs to each other.

As much as I disliked the changes to the LotR, Jackson's adaption was waaaaaaaaaaaay more Tolkien than this show. The utter trash known as the Hobbit movies were a different story.

Tolkien changed the details constantly, reading the 22 History of Middle Earth books show that the details were always very, very fungible. The universal themes are the key, the details serve that end. I am genuinely shocked that the sow writers got the ends right, because I rather expetlcred empty reverence for incidental details, as Jackson did.

Your mixing up details. Tokien's details had a style which is distinctly Tolkien. Look at any of his changes and they all have the details that create his style, and it is THOSE details that are lacking from the show. Not whether Celeborn is married to Galadriel or Teleporno is married to Galadriel.

Look at it this way. The themes of friendship, providence, free choice, an internal stuggle with darkness while seeking the light, and recapitulation are present in Narnia, Wonderland and Middle Earth. The details of how those things are achieved are what make Narnia, Wonderland and Middle Earth all feel different. The show failed to achieve the details necessary to feel like Tolkien.

 

[Parmandur]

As much as I disliked the changes to the LotR, Jackson's adaption was waaaaaaaaaaaay more Tolkien than this show. The utter trash known as the Hobbit movies were a different story.

Your mixing up details. Tokien's details had a style which is distinctly Tolkien. Look at any of his changes and they all have the details that create his style, and it is THOSE details that are lacking from the show. Not whether Celeborn is married to Galadriel or Teleporno is married to Galadriel.

Look at it this way. The themes of friendship, providence, free choice, an internal stuggle with darkness while seeking the light, and recapitulation are present in Narnia, Wonderland and Middle Earth. The details of how those things are achieved are what make Narnia, Wonderland and Middle Earth all feel different. The show failed to achieve the details necessary to feel like Tolkien.

Different authors have different themes, it's notnjust details. And yes, the chronology differences here, in relation to Tolkien's specific themes, are about as significant as Celeborn/Teleporno changes.

 

[Zardnaar]

Fair enough, but I think it could be argued that Jackson went quite a bit further with his budget, in particular when it comes to world-building.

Jackson had a lot of help from the NZ government and people.

The rules are a but more relaxed here than Hollywood. Some extras helped out in production as well as acting and there stories of farmers letting them store props in barns for example.

 

[FitzTheRuke]

Jackson had a lot of help from the NZ government and people.

The rules are a but more relaxed here than Hollywood. Some extras helped out in production as well as acting and there stories of farmers letting them store props in barns for example.

Yeah it was a big influx of cash into the NZ economy at the time, but also cheaper for him to do it there than almost anywhere else. It was win-win.

 

[MarkB]

As much as I disliked the changes to the LotR, Jackson's adaption was waaaaaaaaaaaay more Tolkien than this show. The utter trash known as the Hobbit movies were a different story.

Your mixing up details. Tokien's details had a style which is distinctly Tolkien. Look at any of his changes and they all have the details that create his style, and it is THOSE details that are lacking from the show. Not whether Celeborn is married to Galadriel or Teleporno is married to Galadriel.

Look at it this way. The themes of friendship, providence, free choice, an internal stuggle with darkness while seeking the light, and recapitulation are present in Narnia, Wonderland and Middle Earth. The details of how those things are achieved are what make Narnia, Wonderland and Middle Earth all feel different. The show failed to achieve the details necessary to feel like Tolkien.

It feels very like Tolkien to me. It feels nothing at all like Narnia or Wonderland to me.

The Harfoots capture the essence of hobbits better in some respects than previous adaptations - the almost supernatural ability to not be seen when they don't want to, the innate kindness that eventually wins out over suspicion and fear - while in other respects being very much their own culture.

The prickly suspicions and mistrust between elves and men, and between elves and dwarves, is much as it was in The Hobbit and LotR, along with the potential for those divides to be bridged by friendships such as Elrond and Durin's, or Bronwyn and Arondir's.

Galadriel's steely determination and driving charisma are very much what I'd expect from one of the elves' greatest leaders, and her blindness to Sauron's manipulations are also well in keeping with Tolkien's character writing.

The details may not match the specifics of the timescale and order of events Tolkien described, but they all feel very Tolkien.

 

[Maxperson]

Different authors have different themes, it's notnjust details. And yes, the chronology differences here, in relation to Tolkien's specific themes, are about as significant as Celeborn/Teleporno changes.

No. They're much more significant than a name change.

 

[Parmandur]

No. They're much more significant than a name change.

In terms of communicating and developing the themes, no, not really. It's different t front he book, because it's a different story inspired by, not an adaptation. The important thing is hitting the Tolkienian notes and personal themes. And even more the details that would matter to reinforce those are things like different registers for characters (Galadriel is walking around talking like the Book of Common Prayer, while the Harfoots are earthy and simple), or people singing songs for their friends. Not calander dates.