RPGs, new games and originality

I'm actually much more interested in conventional things being done well than another not fully thought through experiment.
In my years, I've run into quite a bit of this. Things that have some good ideas, but they're buried under some novel 'to be different' mechanic. Say, an amazing world but it's saddled with a dice system that seems based not on odds, but on the fact the designer wanted to use a doubling cube as a mechanic.
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Faolyn

(she/her)
What's the purpose of the game? What experience are they trying to convey for the players and GM? It looks like a great setting for classic exploration/sandbox play, but the mechanics don't seem to support a lot of direct interaction with the cool stuff the setting offers; more like some kind of tourism.

I apologize if that sounds harsh. I guess I don't understand how the rules showcase the promise of the setting.
I've found it to be much like any other fantasy RPG, just with weirder tech to it. Most of the creatures are there hostile, although there are lots that aren't or at least have unusual motivations that can be used as a way to negotiate with them, and there's plenty of ruins and weird locations to explore. Numenera does expect there to be more exploration than anything else but, like many fantasy games, spends more time on the combat section than on exploration; it could definitely benefit from having non-combat encounter tables. It's possible that the books actually have those tables and I missed them; I certainly haven't read all the setting books and could easily have skipped over them in the books I was reading, since I was reading them for fun and not as a potential GM. The books do have tables for random cyphers, and at least some of the exploration should be about not only finding the cyphers but how they affect the players and world.

The reason why the mechanics don't seem to support exploration that much is because all the mechanics in the game are the same, no matter what, so if you want to explore an area, the GM needs to just assign a number depending on whatever it is the PC is trying to do. There's no need for special rules for exploration, just more guidelines as to what can be found.
 

Micah Sweet

Level Up & OSR Enthusiast
I've found it to be much like any other fantasy RPG, just with weirder tech to it. Most of the creatures are there hostile, although there are lots that aren't or at least have unusual motivations that can be used as a way to negotiate with them, and there's plenty of ruins and weird locations to explore. Numenera does expect there to be more exploration than anything else but, like many fantasy games, spends more time on the combat section than on exploration; it could definitely benefit from having non-combat encounter tables. It's possible that the books actually have those tables and I missed them; I certainly haven't read all the setting books and could easily have skipped over them in the books I was reading, since I was reading them for fun and not as a potential GM. The books do have tables for random cyphers, and at least some of the exploration should be about not only finding the cyphers but how they affect the players and world.

The reason why the mechanics don't seem to support exploration that much is because all the mechanics in the game are the same, no matter what, so if you want to explore an area, the GM needs to just assign a number depending on whatever it is the PC is trying to do. There's no need for special rules for exploration, just more guidelines as to what can be found.
Ah. So the mechanics don't really differentiate between different kinds of activities. That's why it felt weird to me. Thank you.
 



It's my personal take on it, but I felt like the promise of the OSR was two folds: go back to a style of play which has some specific qualities over the more modern approach, use a common framework on which we can build and expand instead of reinventing the wheel constantly. What I seem to see in the several produces I've touched is exactly reinventing the wheel and very little creating new stuff on top of it. The same monsters come back in bestiary after bestiary, equipment lists that are almost identicals, slight variant on the same few rules; or sometimes the rules are exactly the same, but there's just a few different random tables sprinkled around.

If I go and spend 70$ on a big rulebook for a very different system from another publisher, I tend to find something quite different with at least a few interesting things to mull on.
I think the problem here is, to put it bluntly, there's only so much you can do within the paradigm of OSR (or classic D&D from which it claims to draw its inspiration). The reason we went on to other things is really pretty simple, it was a very niche game concept that did a pretty small number of things reasonably well, and was frankly terrible for everything else! This is why 1e trended into trad and 2e was explicitly trad.

I mean, I'm sure there's SOME room in there for doing stuff that wasn't completely explored (or is at least forgotten today) back in the day. Still, a lot of what I see that is OSR just strikes me as "you could do this better another way." The upshot being, all these games are going to be covering kinda the same ground, albeit each with its unique flavor. Most likely if you have read 4 or 5 of these games, the rest are going to sound fairly familiar!

Of course, the other part being, once you break out of the formula, you kinda stop being OSR, so its a bit of a self-limiting RPG genre.
 

Yeah, it's unusual, but at least it's easy to remember!
I'm not sure why anyone would find it UNUSUAL, I mean, BRP (CoC, DQ, etc.) has essentially one mechanic for everything, you roll d% and try to hit a target number. Certain multiples of the target number may produce better/worse results, and combat has some additional rules to handle active defense (parry or dodge) as well as action economy, but its still ESSENTIALLY all the same thing. And games like CoC, which doesn't really focus on combat and elides most of the fancier DQ combat rules, pretty much IS 'single unified mechanic'.

Same with Traveller, roll 2d6+SKILL, 8+ is (usually, at least in early Traveller) a success, period, end of report. Technically there's a parry rule, but the use of primitive weapons is minimal, so it can practically be ignored. Specific situations are often called out in the rules where the 'DC' varies from 8, or there are specific modifiers, and here and there some things like your computer might provide an extra mod. Its an incredibly simple, totally unified, system published in 1977.

And the trend for the past 10-15 years in newer games has been towards this sort of stripped-down single mechanics systems. Outside of D&D the idea of a hodge-podge of dice, tables, different sorts of success criteria, etc. is pretty dead actually.
 


Faolyn

(she/her)
I'm not sure why anyone would find it UNUSUAL, I mean, BRP (CoC, DQ, etc.) has essentially one mechanic for everything, you roll d% and try to hit a target number. Certain multiples of the target number may produce better/worse results, and combat has some additional rules to handle active defense (parry or dodge) as well as action economy, but its still ESSENTIALLY all the same thing. And games like CoC, which doesn't really focus on combat and elides most of the fancier DQ combat rules, pretty much IS 'single unified mechanic'.
Unusual in comparison to the OSR/LU games Micah prefers.
 

Faolyn

(she/her)
I think the problem here is, to put it bluntly, there's only so much you can do within the paradigm of OSR (or classic D&D from which it claims to draw its inspiration). The reason we went on to other things is really pretty simple, it was a very niche game concept that did a pretty small number of things reasonably well, and was frankly terrible for everything else! This is why 1e trended into trad and 2e was explicitly trad.

I mean, I'm sure there's SOME room in there for doing stuff that wasn't completely explored (or is at least forgotten today) back in the day. Still, a lot of what I see that is OSR just strikes me as "you could do this better another way." The upshot being, all these games are going to be covering kinda the same ground, albeit each with its unique flavor. Most likely if you have read 4 or 5 of these games, the rest are going to sound fairly familiar!

Of course, the other part being, once you break out of the formula, you kinda stop being OSR, so its a bit of a self-limiting RPG genre.
I think they could possibly work on creating different settings, something other than Typical D&D With The Serial Numbers Filed Off. Different monsters, for one--too many of them rely on standard D&D monsters, possibly with different names for the ones not released to the OGL. While I don't own DCC, what I've read about wizard corruption is a good example of what I mean, because it automatically paints a different world than a typical D&D world, and a setting could really lean into something like that. They could even do different races. Even though I personally hate race-as-class, which many/most OSR games seem to use, a game could do something other than elf, dwarf, halfling, and maybe (half)orc. A setting with gnomes (crafting/illusion), minotaurs (martial/maze-walking abilities), mushroom-folk (druidy casters), and, I dunno, sugar glider-folk (gliding/climbing/sneakiness) is going to at least feel very different than every other OSR game out there, even if the mechanics are 90% similar.
 

Remove ads

AD6_gamerati_skyscraper

Remove ads

Upcoming Releases

Top