Rule of Three: 05/16/2011

[Camelot]

The cambion could work, with a little reflavoring.

 

[Incenjucar]

The trick is coming up with a monster class that:

- members of any race can be a part of;
- has abilities that a character can focus on to be good at combat.
- has a broad appeal and can be used in most games.

- Members of any race can access transformative magic.
- Monsters that are too complex to be races usually have roughly four schticks each, so their natural complexity is roughly on par with a hexblade.
- Broad appeal can be obtained by making broad classes that can handle a number of ideas, with flexible builds that cater to a small number of broad appeal monsters.

You guys are making this out to be far harder than it actually is. I've done a significant amount of work on the issue, and the only real difficulty I've run into is my lack of experience outside of the heroic tier.

 

[hvg3akaek]

That's why you have a vampire class and a vampiric race. If you want to play a spellcasting vampire, play a vryloka wizard. If you want a character that channels his undead might to battle the forces of Slightly More Evil, play a vampire.

The thing is, vampire as a race never really makes sense. Vampires are always some other sort of race (typically human, but in fantasy, not all the time).

And again, why have two copies of the same thing?

The developers have talked about themes being a third leg (race + class being the others); To allow class choices to still exist, and allows for initial racial identity to be preserved, it should be a template. The *best* they can hope for otherwise is to make it a revenant-like race, that has the 'memories' of the past race within it. Of course, as can be seen with the revenant, they really have very little in the way of racial powers...which is where the template comes back into play.

 

[Klaus]

Re: two versions of the same thing: Personally, I think there should be more than one way to achieve an archetype.

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

Hrm. I can see vampires and lycanthr...therianthro...er, beast-changers of every race...except for the shardminds.

Wilden? Sure, vampiric plants. Warforged? Hell yeah. Have their fangs slide out mechanically or have them flip over and transform.

But a swarm of rocks? Seems a bit more odd. But probably doable.

Brad

 

[Incenjucar]

Liches are vampiric, and all they do is poke you with a bony finger.

Vampirism comes down to draining energy to sustain the self. Blood is a nice way to do this, but you could just as easily steal a breath or a soul or emotion or luck any other vital essence.

You can work just about anything into anything else if you put even a hint of effort into it. See: Mythology.

 

[Aegeri]

Bearing in mind no matter what race the vampire is you have to accept the above explanation. Because vampires can drain surges from constructs, other undead, elementals, oozes and all manner of things without traditional "blood". So whatever it's draining it can't be the traditional blood we think of from horror fiction.

 

[WalterKovacs]

Bearing in mind no matter what race the vampire is you have to accept the above explanation. Because vampires can drain surges from constructs, other undead, elementals, oozes and all manner of things without traditional "blood". So whatever it's draining it can't be the traditional blood we think of from horror fiction.

It's blood except when it's not.

Just like sneak attack damage/backstab comes from being able to hit the right anatomical location ... except when it's not.

There are a lot of situations in the game where the simpler choice was taken. So yes, a vampire will always get a chance to get a surge off a monster, even if it doesn't make "sense" ... but that doesn't mean the vampire only has one way of surge draining.

And, unless the allies are warforged/revenant, they are at least drinking blood for THAT class feature, if not their blood drain/taste of life.

 

[Klaus]

Hrm. I can see vampires and lycanthr...therianthro...er, beast-changers of every race...except for the shardminds.

Wilden? Sure, vampiric plants. Warforged? Hell yeah. Have their fangs slide out mechanically or have them flip over and transform.

But a swarm of rocks? Seems a bit more odd. But probably doable.

Brad

A sentient swarm of bloodrock? Obsidian shards charged with negative energy? Crystals that are actually the congealed blood of a slain god (maybe even Nerull)?

 

[Camelot]

A sentient swarm of bloodrock? Obsidian shards charged with negative energy? Crystals that are actually the congealed blood of a slain god (maybe even Nerull)?

Oh, that's a cool idea...XP to you in spirit.