"Rules: Saiyans" by Anubis

[Anubis]

Sorry, I didn't get it done yet. I ran into a testing problem.

Any which way, the actual rules WILL be done by the end of the month, although I most likely will be unable to get to Vegeta by that time. So ya' get some, but not all.

Anyway, more later.

 

[Anabstercorian]

Here's what I really meant.

I'm sure you've noticed that the first time that Goku transforms to any given level of Super Saiyen, it takes him freakin' forever. But later on, he can do it nearly instantly. I view that like this:

Super Saiyen Transformation

DC 30 - Transform to super saiyen.
DC 50 - Transform to Super Saiyen as a free action.
DC 70 - Transform to Super Saiyen 2.
DC 90 - Transform to Super Saiyen 2 as a free action.
DC 110 - Transform to Super Saiyen 3.

You can roll over and over and over until you succeed. Goku isn't failing, per se - It's just taking him a long time to roll high enough, to reach the proper state of emotional and spiritual purity. However, each time you roll, you take 1d4 hit points of damage - Transforming does drain Ki.

 

[Buddha the DM]

Anabstercorian: What ability score would you key that skill to?

 

[Glorfindel]

Anabstercorian
No it would not suffice in a skill.
Goku never takes time to transform, its only to become super saiyan 3 that takes time.

Movie 12 Son Goten and Trunks changes in les than a second and the return of Kooler Vegita changes just like that.

I don`t mean to be rude or anything the ide itself is good but I don`t think it would capture the DBZ feeling.

And if Goku takes a long time charging up to become Super Saiyan please give me the number of the episod =))

And Buddha the DM probably Con =)

 

[Anubis]

Anabstercorian
No it would not suffice in a skill.
Goku never takes time to transform, its only to become super saiyan 3 that takes time.

Movie 12 Son Goten and Trunks changes in les than a second and the return of Kooler Vegita changes just like that.

I don`t mean to be rude or anything the ide itself is good but I don`t think it would capture the DBZ feeling.

And if Goku takes a long time charging up to become Super Saiyan please give me the number of the episod =))

And Buddha the DM probably Con =)

Anabstercorian is correct about the first transformation into any Super Saiyan form taking a long time. See the following episodes for each person and transformation:

Goku, Super Saiyan, Episode 80 "Transformed At Last"
Goku, Super Saiyan 2, Not Shown (happens while Goku is in the afterlife)
Goku, Super Saiyan 3, Episode 230 "Super Saiyan 3?!"
Vegeta, Super Saiyan, Episode 114 "Upgrade To Super Saiyan"
Vegeta, Super Saiyan 2, Unknown (attains this power through Babidi's control)
Gohan, Super Saiyan, Episode 152 "The Doomsday Broadcast"
Gohan, Super Saiyan 2, Episode 169 Children Of Cell Attack" - 170 "The Unleashing"
Trunks, Super Saiyan, Not Shown (Mirai Trunks shown during Trunks Special)
Goten, Super Saiyan, Not Shown
Gotenks, Super Saiyan 3, Episode 245 "Feeding Frenzy"

Glorfindel, you are, however, correct that once the first transformation occurs, it is done effortlessly in the future. That is precisely why I felt a skill check would not suffice. Only the first transformation takes time, and after that, it's no problem at all, except for Super Saiyan 3, which does take a small amount of time.

I would make transformations after the first a free or move-equivilent action.

 

[Glorfindel]

Thanks Anubis.
You realy know your Dragon Ball Z =))
I guess your not going to make any of the NPC`s from the series like Perfect Cell?

Were is the thread about Tyranids?

 

[Daelin_Farseer]

Super Saiyajin

Two points of note:

Actually, Gohan did try and fail to become a super saiyajin on at least one (visible) occasion. This, of course, does depend on your definition of fail, but it is arguable that for the first several months that Gohan and Goku spent in the alternate dimension, Gohan tried and failed several times to turn into a super saiyajin.

Also, it is commonly held, online at least, that the SSJ3 form is one that can only be attained through training. No form of anger-driven powerup or magical boost (as in the case of Majin Vegita being able to achieve SSJ2) can elevate someone's power to that point. I don't have an episode reference for this one, but I only own DVD's up to the creation of Vegitto and don't generally trust the content of the American dubbed versions of the episodes.

Next, Goku indicates in the episode where he turns SSJ3 that he 'isn't used to the transformation' (from memory and the subbed, DVD, version). He has obviously transformed that way before, and the length of time that the transformation requires is debatable.

And finally, there is some support to the idea that powering up to the SSJ level -is- a trainable skill, provided sufficient power exists. When quizzed by Mirai Trunks after his arrival on Earth, Goku states (again, from memory) that '..at first, I couldn't transform unless I was angry, but then it got easier..'. Thing is, we never actually -see- any of this on screen. In almost every case, we either see an initial transformation or one that the protagonists are very comfortable with. It's all this 'behind the scenes' stuff that otherwise complicates the issue.

 

[Anubis]

Re: Super Saiyajin

Actually, Gohan did try and fail to become a super saiyajin on at least one (visible) occasion. This, of course, does depend on your definition of fail, but it is arguable that for the first several months that Gohan and Goku spent in the alternate dimension, Gohan tried and failed several times to turn into a super saiyajin.

Remember though that those failure were prior to his ever becoming a Super Saiyan. For whatever reason, Gohan had more trouble than anyone gaining power.

Also, it is commonly held, online at least, that the SSJ3 form is one that can only be attained through training. No form of anger-driven powerup or magical boost (as in the case of Majin Vegita being able to achieve SSJ2) can elevate someone's power to that point. I don't have an episode reference for this one, but I only own DVD's up to the creation of Vegitto and don't generally trust the content of the American dubbed versions of the episodes.

Actually, all Super Saiyan forms require training. This will be reflected in the Super Saiyan template.

Next, Goku indicates in the episode where he turns SSJ3 that he 'isn't used to the transformation' (from memory and the subbed, DVD, version). He has obviously transformed that way before, and the length of time that the transformation requires is debatable.

That is why a Super Saiyan 3 transformation, unlike all others, requires time.

And finally, there is some support to the idea that powering up to the SSJ level -is- a trainable skill, provided sufficient power exists. When quizzed by Mirai Trunks after his arrival on Earth, Goku states (again, from memory) that '..at first, I couldn't transform unless I was angry, but then it got easier..'. Thing is, we never actually -see- any of this on screen. In almost every case, we either see an initial transformation or one that the protagonists are very comfortable with. It's all this 'behind the scenes' stuff that otherwise complicates the issue.

This is a questionable issue at best. Once Vegeta goes Super Saiyan the first time, he never again has any trouble. Trunks and Goten seem to never have trouble in the first place. Basically, since even the series is a bit sporadic on this issue, I am going to disregard it for the sake of simplicity.

I have also disregarded the "middle" levels such as Super Saiyan 2nd Grade, Super Saiyan 3rd Grade, Super Saiyan Full Power, etc. These levels overly complicate matters and are so rarely used that no suitable information about these forms really exist to a great enough extent to warrant a conversion.

 

[Anubis]

Update - September 28, 2002:

Rules for Super Saiyans are finally up!

 

[Glorfindel]

YAY the rules, all the rules *smiles*
Now I can finaly start planing the campaigns.
Anubis I hope you have time to do Majin Vegeta =)
He is vital to the campaign and I don`t trust my self to do him, I tried but he is just getting to overpowered, even for a Saiyan (go figure =).

Oh Have you ever read or seen the Anime serie the Guyver?
If you have there is a fan-fic that I realy like called emm "Great war of the Guyvers" there they have this guyver called Anubis that is realy cool =))

Looking forward to more info =)