Secret Doors: Elves vs. Rogues

[Dog Moon]

My group was playing through an adventure on Sunday [coincidentally the World's Largest Dungeon]. The Wizard in the group is an Elf whereas I am a Rogue. I, the Rogue, max out Search because I know how useful it is [in finding hidden items, traps, and, of course, secret doors]. The Wizard maxes out Search as well because he's an Elf and whenever and Elf passes within 5 feet of a secret door, gets an automatic Search check as if he was actively searching for it. This is the only reason he maxed Search [as he said]. Somewhere, I'm not sure if me or the DM first mentioned it, the idea is put into the air that Elves should not have it, but Rogues should. After all, Rogues are made for finding stuff like that. Elves, apparently, have keen eyesight and notice things. But how likely are they to know that a slightly discolored rock surface means its a secret entrance [for example]. They're a forest people. The Rogue would be more likely to notice it because he looks for what isn't supposed to be found. We decided that Elves shouldn't get that ability (or only in forests) and that Rogues should. However, we weren't sure how balanced that was to give this to the Rogue. So, can anyone help?

 

[gtJormungand]

The wizard cannot normally have many ranks in Search anyway because it is not a class skill for him. After a few more levels, most rogues should be able to outstrip a wizard in that area. It is a special ability for elves and makes elven rogues rather valuable in that area.

 

[Jhulae]

Elves have it becasue they have acute senses.

Whether it's because of a slight discoloration, a little prickle on the skin from minute air currents, almost imperceptable scuffings, or a gut feeling, elves have a chance of noticing those things.

While rogues may train themselves, training just doesn't compete with this inborn 'secret door sixth sense'.

Only a few classes get search as a class skill, so unless an elf takes one of those classes, an elf isn't really going to have a huge advantage over someone who actively searches. Of course, an elf in a class with search as a class skill is definitely the best for detecting secret doors.

 

[Dog Moon]

Cosmopolitan

The wizard cannot normally have many ranks in Search anyway because it is not a class skill for him. After a few more levels, most rogues should be able to outstrip a wizard in that area. It is a special ability for elves and makes elven rogues rather valuable in that area.

There's a feat called Cosmopolitan which makes a single skill a class skill and adds +2 to the skill. The Wizard has that.

I forgot to mention earlier that we were thinking of having a lesser version of the elven ability for the rogue. Basically, the rogue is always taking 'x', where x is equal to 1/2 the rogue level [prolly max of 10 at 20th level]. This would be due to his training, rather like the whole trap sense ability. Or if there is some other way to do it, assuming it doesn't unbalance the rogue.

 

[sierzadon]

Sneaky wizard

There's a feat called Cosmopolitan which makes a single skill a class skill and adds +2 to the skill. The Wizard has that.

I forgot to mention earlier that we were thinking of having a lesser version of the elven ability for the rogue. Basically, the rogue is always taking 'x', where x is equal to 1/2 the rogue level [prolly max of 10 at 20th level]. This would be due to his training, rather like the whole trap sense ability. Or if there is some other way to do it, assuming it doesn't unbalance the rogue.

If the wizard spent a feat to become "more like a rogue" instead of "typical" wizard skills (whatever that is), encourage him to walk in front and search the place. If he agrees, stop wasting your skill points

 

[Darklone]

The Cosmopolitan feat was changed in 3.5 in PGtF.

 

[Kae'Yoss]

Verasatile lets's you make two cross-class skills class skills.

 

[Gort]

Am I the only one who always hated this power?

GM: "Oh, so you walked THERE? Er... what's your search check again?"

Rogue: "I take 20 on a search for hidden doors. 87."

GM: *sigh* "Yes, there's a door..."

 

[mikebr99]

Am I the only one who always hated this power?

GM: "Oh, so you walked THERE? Er... what's your search check again?"

Rogue: "I take 20 on a search for hidden doors. 87."

GM: *sigh* "Yes, there's a door..."

And the rest of the party has moved on because the Rogue is still "taking 20".

Mike

 

[Gort]

Except that my party isn't stupid enough to move around an unexplored dungeon with no scout.