Shadowdark Shadowdark General Thread [+]

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

The scroll rules as written mean that casters could find lots of scrolls and know loads of spells all the time.

So your proposed fix is intended to limit that? I'm confused.

Also the scenarios i have in mind are old school and enemy wizard spellbooks are a significant treasure.

Well, nothing says that you can't have "scrolls" look like spellbooks or something else. Having a bunch of scrolls bound into a book would still make them a valuable prize for wizards, both PC and NPCs, and keep this aesthetic as part of the game. (I love spellbooks, too.)

And how does a SD wizard or witch actually learn new spells?

Page 24 of the rulebook:

Learning Spells. You can permanently learn a wizard spell from a spell scroll by studying it for a day and succeeding on a DC 15 Intelligence check.

Whether you succeed or fail, you expend the spell scroll.

Spells you learn in this way don't count toward your known spells.

Spellcasting. You can cast wizard spells you know.

You know three tier 1 spells of your choice from the wizard spell list (see pg. 52).

Each time you gain a level, you choose new wizard spells to learn according to the Wizard Spells Known table.

Since some priest spells are no-brainer choices widening choice will de-homogenise.

That's not my experience of RPG players -- I find they tend to try and gravitate toward a "best" list of spells -- but maybe your players are more adventurous than that.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Well, nothing says that you can't have "scrolls" look like spellbooks or something else. Having a bunch of scrolls bound into a book would still make them a valuable prize for wizards, both PC and NPCs, and keep this aesthetic as part of the game. (I love spellbooks, too.)

Thinking about this, maybe "spellbooks" are permanent scroll objects that can't be used to cast spells directly from, but which can be used to teach multiple apprentices spells, maybe with only a chance of vanishing off the page after they're used.

So they'd still exist in the world -- and be very valuable magic items to seek out -- but wouldn't be a requirement for all wizards.

Because I agree with you, @NN, that spellbooks are awesome.

 

[Velderan]

And how does a SD wizard or witch actually learn new spells?

@Whizbang Dustyboots already explained wizards, but witches just gain spells by leveling according to the chart in Cursed Scroll #1. They can potentially get an extra spell of any tier they can cast by rolling an 10 or 11 when they get a new talent, but unless I'm missing something that's it.

 

[Keldryn]

After reading so many good things about it, I finally gave Shadowdark a try a few months ago. Our regular (mostly every other week) 5e game was on hold due to scheduling issues, so I proposed running a Shadowdark game as an alternative until everyone's schedules lined up again.

I'm not sure if I want to go back to 5e now. I've been having more fun DMing Shadowdark than I have in years.

Back when I was running a 4e game and getting burned out on the rules heaviness and long battles, I ran a couple of one-shots using B/X or AD&D rules. I remember loving how much faster the old games played, but the clunkiness of many of the game mechanics were difficult to overlook. The D&D Next playset looked like it was heading back towards a much more rules-lite game than 3e or 4e. And to be fair, the final 5e is still much more to my liking than either 3e or 4e.

But I think that Shadowdark might just be my all-time favorite version of D&D. Speaking as a DM, at least. It absolutely recaptures that feeling of the D&D that I grew up with (BECMI and AD&D) but through the lens of the last 30 years of game design.

Improvising is easy again; I found 3e and later to be much more difficult to run smoothly without a lot of prep time. I absolutely love the Shadowdark monster statblocks, where the majority are of B/X complexity with a single special trait or ability. Easy to parse at a glance.

Honestly, I can't say enough good things about it. Everyone in my group has been having a great time with it.

 

[Bill Zebub]

After reading so many good things about it, I finally gave Shadowdark a try a few months ago. Our regular (mostly every other week) 5e game was on hold due to scheduling issues, so I proposed running a Shadowdark game as an alternative until everyone's schedules lined up again.

I'm not sure if I want to go back to 5e now. I've been having more fun DMing Shadowdark than I have in years.

Back when I was running a 4e game and getting burned out on the rules heaviness and long battles, I ran a couple of one-shots using B/X or AD&D rules. I remember loving how much faster the old games played, but the clunkiness of many of the game mechanics were difficult to overlook. The D&D Next playset looked like it was heading back towards a much more rules-lite game than 3e or 4e. And to be fair, the final 5e is still much more to my liking than either 3e or 4e.

But I think that Shadowdark might just be my all-time favorite version of D&D. Speaking as a DM, at least. It absolutely recaptures that feeling of the D&D that I grew up with (BECMI and AD&D) but through the lens of the last 30 years of game design.

Improvising is easy again; I found 3e and later to be much more difficult to run smoothly without a lot of prep time. I absolutely love the Shadowdark monster statblocks, where the majority are of B/X complexity with a single special trait or ability. Easy to parse at a glance.

Honestly, I can't say enough good things about it. Everyone in my group has been having a great time with it.

So....Retreater wasn't at your table, huh?

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

3. Any advice moving to 9 point alignment?
i cant see any issues.

Forgot to address this. No, nothing will change. Alignment in Shadowdark is mostly a light worldbuilding tool. If it has any mechanical effects, they're very minor and it would be easy to adapt to adding the evil/good axis as well. (I loved AD&D weapons doing bonus damage to chaotic creatures or good creatures, etc., which is simple to add in, if you are into that kind of thing.)

 

[DarkCrisis]

The Witches Hypnotize (for level 3 or less does nothing while locking eyes with the Witch. DC 15 Cha save if loses eye lock to end) and the Bards fasinate ability (basically the same except level 4 and multi target!) seems horribly broken.

Pretty powerful for Level 1 PCs.

I know a Solo Boss is typically a bad idea but I was think oh a demon is the boss after some subtle hints through out the dungeon. Round 1 Witch Hypnos the demon (Vrock) and they curb stomp him no problem. Woo boss fight.

 

[Scribe]

The Witches Hypnotize (for level 3 or less does nothing while locking eyes with the Witch. DC 15 Cha save if loses eye lock to end) and the Bards fasinate ability (basically the same except level 4 and multi target!) seems horribly broken.

Pretty powerful for Level 1 PCs.

I know a Solo Boss is typically a bad idea but I was think oh a demon is the boss after some subtle hints through out the dungeon. Round 1 Witch Hypnos the demon (Vrock) and they curb stomp him no problem. Woo boss fight.

Yeah, save or suck and a solo creature that can be all she wrote.

 

[orangefruitbat]

The Witches Hypnotize (for level 3 or less does nothing while locking eyes with the Witch. DC 15 Cha save if loses eye lock to end) and the Bards fasinate ability (basically the same except level 4 and multi target!) seems horribly broken.

Pretty powerful for Level 1 PCs.

I know a Solo Boss is typically a bad idea but I was think oh a demon is the boss after some subtle hints through out the dungeon. Round 1 Witch Hypnos the demon (Vrock) and they curb stomp him no problem. Woo boss fight.

The Vrock is level 5, so Hypnotize won't work on it.

And for level 3 or less opponents, you still need to cast the spell (and sustain it every round), with a DC 11. So the average witch PC probably has a 60% chance to cast it or sustain it. Odds are, you will only get one round of hypnosis in. So it's powerful, but not a guarantee at all.

 

[DarkCrisis]

The Vrock is level 5, so Hypnotize won't work on it.

And for level 3 or less opponents, you still need to cast the spell (and sustain it every round), with a DC 11. So the average witch PC probably has a 60% chance to cast it or sustain it. Odds are, you will only get one round of hypnosis in. So it's powerful, but not a guarantee at all.

UGH! I had it stuck in my head it was level 2!