D&D (2024) Should 2014 Half Elves and Half Orcs be added to the 2025 SRD?

[Not a Decepticon]

I didn't ask what you think shouldn't count. I asked what you think should. Or is your vision humans with the occasional template for flavor?

But I have defined what qualifies as a playable species - a species must have a mechanical and narrative role that does not boil down "my parents or ancestors were X". Half-Orc and Half-Elf do not qualify, neither do Tieflings and Aasimar, nor Dragonborn, nor 2024 Goliaths. Elves, orcs, humans, Dwarves, Lupin, Tabaxi, Lizardfolk, Centaurs, Goblinso, Hobgoblins, etc.

Again, I provide the example of the Jem'hadar and the Vorta from DS9. The specific origin of the Jem'hadar is ambiguous (beyond the obvious genetic engineering involved), but the Vorta were literally bred from an existing species for the purpose of developing and enhancing selected traits. From my point of view, neither of these differ in a significant way from the Uruk-Hai, and none of them are narratively off-limts.

And I do not care about examples taken from a science-fiction I do not know, nor is it part of the discussion. Especially when you pulled one only now and try to make it look like you have before. The Half-Orcs are just Uruk-Hai with different name, and Uruk-Hai are just Orcs, so their niche is very much nonexistent, and the eugenics background only makes it worse.

 

[Vaalingrade]

It would be nice for D&D to focus more on creating original species that aren't basically watered down versions of the thing you actually want to play if they're not just going to let us play the thing we want to play.

People treat them like jokes, by the furry species are better at being interesting then most of the PH species. Great British Hippo Man is are least a concept on its own as opposed to Orc but worse, dragon but worse and devil but the community saved it by ignoring all the official lore (which don't get me wrong, I love modern teiflings, but we're at the point now that half the PH is the dollar store version of something from the MM). Just get some people who actually want to to work and have them remake Savage Species but with a proper title and a directive to never ever use LA ever again.

 

[Delazar]

(haven't read the whole 52 pages)

Historically all "half" races were half-human, so I would like an Origin Feat (prerequisite: human) that gives you some traits from another Species, and done.

 

[Remathilis]

IGoliaths were another "now shut up" race for people who wanted to play Orcs or ogres, imo. 2024 Goliaths in particular made me put them in the same category as Aasimar nd Tieflings - this should be something any species should take to reflect celestial/fiendish/giant herritage in their veins, not a full species

Goliaths were a mechanical compromise to allow players to play "large" PCs without the headaches of being large (and all the power of it).a story wise, they were a race of humanoids with giant-like features that claimed to descend from true giants and often fight with them. They were never half-giants, but people insisted on treating them like that and WotC has responded by increasing the giant bloodline link.

Then again, the D&D community has this rather nasty habit of reducing every species that "descended from X" as a "Half-X".. The tiefling was originally described as part "something else, usually sinister" into half-fiends. Dragonborn never were the offspring of humanoids and dragons in any origin but that doesn't stop the community from calling them half-dragons. Shifters have a long and tortured history with lycanthropy, even implying a chicken or the egg scenario on which came first, but all the community knows is "half werewolf". At this point, I think the tabaxi is only safe from being called a "half-cat" because people don't want the implications of their parents!

And that wouldn't be bad if the next step to that is "make them a template or a feat" Which further reduces any attempt to make them more than "half-x" and de-legitimize them. A lot of ink was placed in attempts to make most of these species more than "momma was a human, daddy was a dragon/giant/angel/demon/genie/werewolf/vampire/whatever" and yet people keep ignoring it.

 

[Alzrius]

The tiefling was originally described as part "something else, usually sinister" into half-fiends.

I've noticed that one too, and I've never cared for it. The original presentation of tieflings, where they're at most one-quarter fiendish (and usually a lot less than that, having a "somewhere back in your bloodline" vibe to their typical portrayal), strikes me as much more evocative, and mechanically easier to portray without being overpowered.

 

[Remathilis]

I've noticed that one too, and I've never cared for it. The original presentation of tieflings, where they're at most one-quarter fiendish (and usually a lot less than that, having a "somewhere back in your bloodline" vibe to their typical portrayal), strikes me as much more evocative, and mechanically easier to portray without being overpowered.

The issue is that for a lot of players (and DMs), the idea that "somewhere back in your bloodline" ends basically at "your mom and dad". I actually blame half-elves a bit for this; for at least 20+ years, half-elves were described as being a true-breeding species, sometimes with their own culture (Eberron) but every half-elf I've ever seen is a first generation elf daddy/human momma (or vice versa) blend. (This thinking goes back to AD&D, when literal % bloodlines determine if you were an elf, half-elf, or human).

Which is why I'm fine with moving the idea of half-anything into something other than species and instead making every species a true-breeding one that long ago has some monstrous element to it (if any). Goliaths are goliaths, not half-giants and if you want a human/elf mix, it will be something other than a separate species.

 

[Micah Sweet]

The issue is that for a lot of players (and DMs), the idea that "somewhere back in your bloodline" ends basically at "your mom and dad". I actually blame half-elves a bit for this; for at least 20+ years, half-elves were described as being a true-breeding species, sometimes with their own culture (Eberron) but every half-elf I've ever seen is a first generation elf daddy/human momma (or vice versa) blend. (This thinking goes back to AD&D, when literal % bloodlines determine if you were an elf, half-elf, or human).

Which is why I'm fine with moving the idea of half-anything into something other than species and instead making every species a true-breeding one that long ago has some monstrous element to it (if any). Goliaths are goliaths, not half-giants and if you want a human/elf mix, it will be something other than a separate species.

If you're right, good luck getting any actual players on-board with the "back in the distant past" idea. From what you've said, it sounds like the ship on that has sailed.

 

[CreamCloud0]

The issue is that for a lot of players (and DMs), the idea that "somewhere back in your bloodline" ends basically at "your mom and dad". I actually blame half-elves a bit for this; for at least 20+ years, half-elves were described as being a true-breeding species, sometimes with their own culture (Eberron) but every half-elf I've ever seen is a first generation elf daddy/human momma (or vice versa) blend. (This thinking goes back to AD&D, when literal % bloodlines determine if you were an elf, half-elf, or human).

i know there are alot of species but tiefling being the main example for the 'somewhere back in your bloodline' i've gotten the impression most people weren't ever thinking of tiefings with a demon as one of their parents.

half elves are interesting seeing as while they do breed true and have their own societies in some settings but they very much are explicitly produced from unions between elves and human.

 

[Not a Decepticon]

And that wouldn't be bad if the next step to that is "make them a template or a feat"

I could see an origin feat you could take in place of background one - you get features of either lower places bloodline or giant bloodline or upper planes bloodline.

Maybe there should be feats that affect what culture you were raised on too?

 

[Remathilis]

I could see an origin feat you could take in place of background one - you get features of either lower places bloodline or giant bloodline or upper planes bloodline.

Maybe there should be feats that affect what culture you were raised on too?

There is already a feat that gives you a connection to the outer planes (Scion of the Outer Planes) and to giants (Strike of the Giants), neither of which turn you into a tiefling/assimar or goliath nor do they replace the need for the other. If you WANT to use the giant feats from Bigby's in place of the goliath, be my guest.