D&D 5E Should martial characters be mundane or supernatural?

[Vaalingrade]

Yeah, snipers are not known for their brash and obvious fighting style.

 

[overgeeked]

It’s also worth noting everyone has access to all the same skills. The rogue doesn’t hide better than anyone else. Anyone with the same DEX hides just as good as the rogue. They get expertise…which the bard gets, too. Anyone can hide, sneak, pick locks, disable traps, etc just as good as the rogue.

 

[Minigiant]

Sniping is hitting a vulnerable location by help of advantage gained from hiding. That is literally a form of sneak attack.

Sniping doesn't have to be from active hiding. You can snipe out of the target's sight range. You can snipe while seen.

Usually the important thing is the distance and accuracy.

 

[Maxperson]

The problem isn't that goading should work under some circumstances. Want to goad an NPC in a bar? Give me an intimidation check.

It's supernatural if it works, or has a decent chance to work, under any and all situations. Want to goad an ooze? Good luck with that unless it's a supernatural ability. Which is the problem I had with 4E fighters until I just accepted that all fighters were supernatural in that edition.

4e actually says that martials were magic. There's a line in the martial section where it says that their abilities are not magic in the traditional sense, which means that they are magic in an untraditional sense.

 

[Maxperson]

It’s also worth noting everyone has access to all the same skills. The rogue doesn’t hide better than anyone else. Anyone with the same DEX hides just as good as the rogue. They get expertise…which the bard gets, too. Anyone can hide, sneak, pick locks, disable traps, etc just as good as the rogue.

That's a mistake in bards, though. Bards were a jack of all trades, master of none class. Giving them mastery via expertise was a blunder on the part of WotC. Even so, it's okay to have multiple skill monkey classes, because the flavors are different.

 

[Crimson Longinus]

Sniping doesn't have to be from active hiding. You can snipe out of the target's sight range. You can snipe while seen.

Yes, just like sneak attack!

Seriously, you're trying to create duplicate mechanic for a thing the game already has a mechanic for and in the process destroy a combat niche of one class. This is terrible design.

 

[Vaalingrade]

Sniping doesn't have to be from active hiding. You can snipe out of the target's sight range. You can snipe while seen.

Usually the important thing is the distance and accuracy.

And precision damage, such as when you get Sneak attack from getting advantage on a guy you're face to face with.

Snipping was Sneak Attack the whole time. Just like Bruce Willis.

 

[Minigiant]

Yes, just like sneak attack!

Seriously, you're trying to create duplicate mechanic for a thing the game already has a mechanic for and in the process destroy a combat niche of one class. This is terrible design.

Destroy nothing.

There is more to nonmagical combat than.

1) Attack a lot
2) Deal a lot of damage while you have advantage

The fighter doesn't need advantage. They are skilled archers. They can shoot you in the face while you are looking. Element of surprise not needed.

A horse archer who terrorizes the battlefield and sieges the Empire is no rogue. They are a fighter and should be able to make one good shot.

This is what I mean about limitations of mundane martials. It's one thing to say that you want the game simple.

It's another to say the Marksman fighter subclass can't snipe or needs to use magic to deal one big chunk of damage.

Rogues should not have a monopoly on precision damage and doesn't make sense for fighters not having it.

 

[Tony Vargas]

There is more to nonmagical combat than.
1) Attack a lot
2) Deal a lot of damage while you have advantage

There's
3) die?

Rogues were never snipers.

Spoiler: the eternal exception

 

[Minigiant]

There's
3) die?

Spoiler: the eternal exception

View attachment 310297

That doesn't count. 4e had to name a zillion powers. And Fighters couldn't shoot bows in 4e.

By that logic Fighter are magic as the were Giants and rocs and griffons.