D&D 5E Should the Fighter's "Second Wind" ability grant temporary HP instead of regular HP?

[Emerikol]

I don't want second wind at all in my game so I have no way of voting. I won't use it with temp or real hit points.

 

[Emerikol]

If you are so implacable that you consider this a sign of "complete disdain" then there is no reason to care about what you think: you will never be happy and your feedback should be shredded, unread.

Seriously, listening to you would be a mistake, and I hope the developers realized that.

I realize there's a certain element to saying "if you don't like the onions just pick them out" but you ordered a modern RPG and are upset that it contains modern elements that show the developers have learned from the last two decades of game development. Because it's a game, and should be fun, and fun is more important than making sure you've sanded off every corner that some grog might get his elbow caught on. That means that characters should be largely self-contained and not reliant on another class for their base functionality. You wouldn't design a warlock class that gets bonus damage against cursed targets, but has no way of cursing. Why would you design a front line defender that expects to chew through hit points, but has to rely on external sources to get hit points back? A wizard that can cast all sorts of spells, but needs a Bookomancer to refresh them?

Hit points are the Fighter's spellbook.

This attitude is the problem. The use of terms like "modern" etc... Personally I believe all you are doing by not presenting options is funnelling the new gamers over to Pathfinder. Lots of those new gamers are just like me. It's not a grog vs modern debate at all. It's purely a playstyle preference debate and it's about a game.

I guess when Pathfinder buys the D&D name from Hasbro after there hasn't been a new edition for twenty years, you'll realize how silly it is to claim it's all about tradition like your take on hit points is objectively better than anyone elses IN A GAME.

 

[Thaumaturge]

That is funny

Thanks.

I think this is reasonable, yes. It tends to imply that some (much?) hit point loss, even in rather large numbers, doesn't correspond to grievous wounds. (Which I think you agree with.)

That's probably a good guess. I'm trying not to be a hardliner about much in life. But I'm not draw a hard line about that, either.

The problem is that you also have the situation where someone pulls out a trick the other person doesn't know, and wins the fight in the first few seconds. D&D gives you either that at low levels, or a long period of testing each others defences at higher levels (followed by a decisive blow), but doesn't typically allow for a quick result against an opponent with a lot of hit points or for a long battle with a low-hit point one.

Ok.

I think [MENTION=42582]pemerton[/MENTION]'s solution is pretty good, and I'll likely use it, if it ever comes up.

This was found on a scrap of parchment on the corpse of an orc runner. What should we make of it?

From Orc King Grumbshod to all military commanders,
Greetings! You are to inform your troops that Blogshott's Tactic is no longer to be employed. Hitherto, when an enemy warrior stopped attacking unexpectedly and cried "Sekondd Winns", it was a signal for our glorious troops to disengage, seem to flee, wait for 10 minutes the relaunch their attack. Things have changed. Henceforth, if an enemy warrior cries "Sekondd Winns" whilst continuing to attack, the approved tactic now is to rally the orc comrades and press home our attack with all ferocity, for it will be a sure sign that he is in mortal fear and close to death.

That if one wants internal consistency in a campaign, one shouldn't run a campaign using regularly updated playtest material?

Thaumaturge.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

Lots of those new gamers are just like me.

I guess when Pathfinder buys the D&D name from Hasbro after there hasn't been a new edition for twenty years, you'll realize how silly it is to claim it's all about tradition like your take on hit points is objectively better than anyone elses IN A GAME.

God I hope a lot of new players aren't like you... You are Argueing that 1 aility to shrug off the negative effects of combat (aka hp loss) being given to a class called fighter will result in the sale of Dand D to its compatuin (one that as much as I like as a company has not produced 1 good rpg supplement I would buy in years)

If a lot of new players are that engrossed in the edition war already we should all pack it in

 

[BoldItalic]

That if one wants internal consistency in a campaign, one shouldn't run a campaign using regularly updated playtest material?

Thaumaturge.

Maybe. On the other hand, if the way a PC combat feature works is indeed changed, perhaps it's not so terrible because the way monsters fight can, to a certain extent, be adapted by DMs to compensate. That's a choice that DM's can make individually.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

At which point you get the interesting position where people wander around knowing that they can't be killed with a sword; because if the only start worrying when their hit points are low, obviously swords are bad at killing healthy and experineed people.

Welcome to D&D where a 50ft fall does 5d6 and the 4th level fighter has 4d10+x hp and can

 

[BryonD]

At which point you get the interesting position where people wander around knowing that they can't be killed with a sword; because if the only start worrying when their hit points are low, obviously swords are bad at killing healthy and experineed people.

In D&D that is the way it has always been.
You also have the issue of the sniper in the window can't one shot you (without being in a specific class built to end run the system on this point)

D&D is pretty much high fantasy and you have to roll with that if you want D&D to work for you.
You DON'T have to want D&D to work for you. There was a long time when I would not play D&D and mostly played GURPS. My preference for low fantasy and this exact issue with immunity to death without a good chipping away first was high on the list. I've long since re-embraced high fantasy and this quasi-immunity is ok for me. Bouncing back from the "chipping away" too fast still is a deal breaker for me. Other people may feel more strongly than me on these and other points and others yet may not care at all. It is all good.

But they are different points and seeing them separately is not a problem.

 

[BryonD]

God I hope a lot of new players aren't like you... You are Argueing that 1 aility to shrug off the negative effects of combat (aka hp loss) being given to a class called fighter will result in the sale of Dand D to its compatuin (one that as much as I like as a company has not produced 1 good rpg supplement I would buy in years)

If a lot of new players are that engrossed in the edition war already we should all pack it in

It isn't edition war to simply state that you won't play a game if it doesn't service your needs.
It would be if you were slamming someone else for THEM liking it even though it doesn't service your needs.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

It isn't edition war to simply state that you won't play a game if it doesn't service your needs.
It would be if you were slamming someone else for THEM liking it even though it doesn't service your needs.

Yes saying "hey this isn't my cup of tea" isn't edition warring

Saying piazo will out last and buy up D&D is very much so

 

[ThirdWizard]

If a lot of new players are that engrossed in the edition war already we should all pack it in

Over on reddit, I see posts (sometimes a few a week) from new RPGers looking to enter the hobby. The majority seem to be coming either from a video game or a free form forum-based roleplaying background, and I can say with some certainty that they are very open to many ideas and ways to play RPGs. It's very difficult to see this on ENWorld and other more established locations on the internet that tend to deal in one particular subset of roleplaying (in ENWorld's case - D&D), but there is a vast spectrum of rpgs and rpg-lovers that don't give two shakes about what RPG is the best and actually just want to enjoy themselves!

So, don't pack it in quite yet!