Sneak Attack With a Thrown Weapon

[kmdietri]

If a dagger wielding rogue is flanking a target would he get his sneak attack damage if he threw the dagger at the target he is flanking? I know he would draw an AoO.

 

[3d6]

Flanking only works with melee attacks. If you're attacking with a ranged weapon, you're not "flanking" with that attack.

 

[maransreth]

I thought flanking was only possible with melee weapons? I know you can't flank with a ranged weapon like a bow, but thought it wasn't possible with a thrown weapon? Or do you mean the person is 5 foot away from the target (as in standing next to them) and flanking and you want to throw a weapon?

And sneak attack is possible with any type of weapon - be it melee, ranged or thrown so there is no problem with that, just whether you can flank with a thrown weapon.

Duane

 

[Kae'Yoss]

What the others said: You can sneak attack with ranged weapons (indeed: you can sneak attack with *everything* that requires an attack roll), but you cannot flank with a ranged weapon.

 

[UltimaGabe]

No. If you're flanking someone, the only way to get the bonus is to make a Melee attack. You can't get a bonus to a ranged attack by flanking, because you don't threaten an area with a ranged weapon. So if you threatened an area with a dagger, you have to make a melee attack with that dagger. You can't throw it and still get the bonus. (And, thus, if you threw it, it wouldn't be a sneak attack as you were no longer flanking him once you decided to throw it.)

 

[Hypersmurf]

No. If you're flanking someone, the only way to get the bonus is to make a Melee attack.

Your conclusion is right, but your reasoning is wrong.

You don't need to threaten someone to gain the benefits of flanking, as long as your ally threatens them. For example, you can flank with a whip (does not threaten an area) or an untrained unarmed strike (does not threaten an area).

You do need to be making a melee attack to gain the benefits of flanking. For example, a Peerless Archer 8 threatens 10 feet away with his bow. But if he shoots someone he threatens, with an ally on the opposite side threatening also, he's not flanking, because he isn't making a melee attack.

When his ally attacks with his shortsword, however, the ally is flanking, because he's making a melee attack, and his ally (the Peerless Archer) threatens the target, satisfying the requirements for flanking.

-Hyp.

 

[rrealm]

You're conclusion is right, but your reasoning is wrong.

You don't need to threaten someone to gain the benefits of flanking, as long as your ally threatens them. For example, you can flank with a whip (does not threaten an area) or an untrained unarmed strike (does not threaten an area).

You do need to be making a melee attack to gain the benefits of flanking. For example, a Peerless Archer 8 threatens 10 feet away with his bow. But if he shoots someone he threatens, with an ally on the opposite side threatening also, he's not flanking, because he isn't making a melee attack.

When his ally attacks with his shortsword, however, the ally is threatening, because he's making a melee attack, and his ally (the Peerless Archer) threatens the target, satisfying the requirements for flanking.

-Hyp.

FLANKING
When making a melee attack, you get a +2 flanking bonus if your opponent is threatened by a character or creature friendly to you on the opponent’s opposite border or opposite corner.

When in doubt about whether two friendly characters flank an opponent in the middle, trace an imaginary line between the two friendly characters’ centers. If the line passes through opposite borders of the opponent’s space (including corners of those borders), then the opponent is flanked.

Exception: If a flanker takes up more than 1 square, it gets the flanking bonus if any square it occupies counts for flanking.

Only a creature or character that threatens the defender can help an attacker get a flanking bonus.

Creatures with a reach of 0 feet can’t flank an opponent.


You do need to threaten a creature in melee and you must have an ally opposite of your opponent who also threatens. Since whips do not allow one to threaten, they never get a flanking bonus nor do they help someone to do so. Why does a peerless archer have a threat range of 10’ with a bow? Is this a prestige class special ability? A feat?

 

[rrealm]

If a dagger wielding rogue is flanking a target would he get his sneak attack damage if he threw the dagger at the target he is flanking? I know he would draw an AoO.

He would only get the sneak attack if the target was flat-footed since the rogue would not be flanking (using a ranged weapon) nor would he get the +2 bonus to hit (since he is not flanking). A rogue in this situation should make a bluff check and feint in combat which would allow him on his next turn to make a sneak attack - even if it is ranged. Remember that when a rogue is eligible to score a sneak attack, it only applies to the first attack of that given round.

 

[mikebr99]

Remember that when a rogue is eligible to score a sneak attack, it only applies to the first attack of that given round.

Not true... every attack that qualifies is subject to the extra damage from SA. If the Rogue was hasted, two-weapon fighting... etc. a full attack that qualified for SA would get the extra damage on every attack.

It is just invisibility that only helps with SA on the first attack.


Mike

 

[Storm Raven]

You're conclusion is right, but your reasoning is wrong.

You don't need to threaten someone to gain the benefits of flanking, as long as your ally threatens them. For example, you can flank with a whip (does not threaten an area) or an untrained unarmed strike (does not threaten an area).

You do need to be making a melee attack to gain the benefits of flanking. For example, a Peerless Archer 8 threatens 10 feet away with his bow. But if he shoots someone he threatens, with an ally on the opposite side threatening also, he's not flanking, because he isn't making a melee attack.

When his ally attacks with his shortsword, however, the ally is threatening, because he's making a melee attack, and his ally (the Peerless Archer) threatens the target, satisfying the requirements for flanking.

Generally you need to be able to make a melee attack against a target to threatne it, and thus provide your ally with a flanking bonus.

Threatened Squares: You threaten all squares into which you can make a melee attack, even when it is not your action. Generally, that means everything in all squares adjacent to your space (including diagonally). An enemy that takes certain actions while in a threatened square provokes an attack of opportunity from you. If you’re unarmed, you don’t normally threaten any squares and thus can’t make attacks of opportunity.

Reach Weapons: Most creatures of Medium or smaller size have a reach of only 5 feet. This means that they can make melee attacks only against creatures up to 5 feet (1 square) away. However, Small and Medium creatures wielding reach weapons threaten more squares than a typical creature. In addition, most creatures larger than Medium have a natural reach of 10 feet or more.