So I was more or less kicked out of my D&D group

[jdavis]

DarkCrisis, what i get from your last post is that you REALLY don't respect the game this guy was running. If that's the case, why did you bother to show up?

It may be that your contempt for him is showing through during the session; if that's the case, no wonder he's being a jerk to you. It's one thing to disrespect someone by flaking out on the game; it's much worse to disrespect someone openly, to their face, in front of their friends.

Were you doing that? Was your attitude of, "why should I pay attention to this 'it's a room, kill everything in it' description?" obvious to him?

Like I said, I wouldn't play in this game, based on your description of it. But i also wouldn't tolerate behavior like yours in my game, based on your description of it. If you don't enjoy a game, back out gracefully -- don't hang around blatantly ignoring it.

Daniel

You throw around the word disrespect alot. I have friends of mine that I've known for 20 years and sometimes they don't show up and sometimes they don't pay attention, I don't think this is them disrespecting me, I don't live in the army I don't see myself as a athority figure over them, it's a game I don't take it personally, it's obvious you take this game serious and personal, it's obvious you expect everybody around you to take it the same way. There is nothing wrong with that but not everybody sees things that way. You know some people just play this game for fun, they don't live for D&D it's just for fun. In his last post I read where he gave this person a computer (yes a old computer) gee how disrespectful was that to give the guy something, how disrespectful was it for him to call ahead and say he wasn't going to make it when other people just no showed and that was ok, or how disrespectful was it to apologize for reading the book and saying it would not happen again.

 

[Arnwyn]

Heh. I have neither sympathy for the player nor the DM. Both are responsible and both are worthy of a share of the blame.

Paying "partial" attention? I'd drop the player like a bad habit, and then unload that vindictive, uncommunicative wack-job of a DM. Too bad - you guys seem like you were made for each other: a group from hell.

 

[SHARK]

Greetings!

Hey Daniel! Your answer was spot on. It's about courtesy and respect.

Doc Moriarty, hey there! No, Daniel isn't my mommy.

Indeed, I realise it is "just a game", however, why is it any different if my friends say, "Yeah, SHARK, we'll be over this Saturday for the barbecue! Break out the food, some good cigars, it'll be great!"

I go and buy food, beer, cigars, good steaks, chips, and what not, get everything planned, and they just decide at the last minute or the day before that they have something better to do? What the eff! Do you see? Well, why is getting together for the game any different? In reality, it isn't any different. We have agreed to get together at such and such time, on such and such day. I expect at least three days notice, if at all possible, if you are gonna cancel. There is in truth a lot of effort put into entertaining, whether its buying the extra soda, getting the steaks ready, picking up a few extra cigars, or whatever. It really doesn't have that much to do with the game at all, so much as it has to do with respecting me as a friend, and being conscientious about making a committment, and sticking to it. On my end, there is a lot of time, energy, and no small amount of money as well being put out for your pleasure and entertainment. I would think that becasue I, as your friend, and as the DM, making the committment that I do to make the game up, and make all the other preparations for our time together, don't you think that I would deserve a similar level of committment, courtesy, and respect from you?

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

 

[jdavis]

Heh. I have neither sympathy for the player nor the DM. Both are responsible and both are worthy of a share of the blame.

Paying "partial" attention? I'd drop the player like a bad habit, and then unload that vindictive, uncommunicative wack-job of a DM. Too bad - you guys seem like you were made for each other: a group from hell.

Well you convinced me, from now on anybody that doesn't pay intense attention to me 100% of the time is out of there, this isn't a game it's serious stuff, no you can't go to the bathroom, put that phone down, I didn't say you could answer the phone, no you can't go to the kitchen to get a drink, there will be a test on the room discription after the game.

 

[Arnwyn]

Well you convinced me, from now on anybody that doesn't pay intense attention to me 100% of the time is out of there, this isn't a game it's serious stuff, no you can't go to the bathroom, put that phone down, I didn't say you could answer the phone, no you can't go to the kitchen to get a drink, there will be a test on the room discription after the game.

Lol! I suppose I should have quoted more of the original post. It seemed that he was reading a lot during the session, and just paying "partial" attention to the game (since he felt that he didn't to do much more). That wouldn't be acceptable in the game that I run.

Thankfully, they're my friends and like the same type of gaming style that I do - those are the only types of player I'd accept, obviously.

Thanks for your understanding, though.

 

[Pielorinho]

I ask you: Why is it bad for me to read a book or not show up when PC #1 can show up whenever he likes with no calls and PC#2 can read his book and PC#3 Can go missing for 5 weeks then welcomed back. PC#4 and #5 can caht about Warhammer yet I call ahead one night and apologize for reading on another yet my actions demand his wrath. Explain that to me since you seem to know all about it. Explain to me why I have to be treated different.

Explain it

I can't; only you can. I'm discounting the possibility that your DM has multiple-personality disorder, and that the vindictive Sally was in control when you weren't paying attention, whereas the generous Frank was in control when the others were goofing off.

That means you must have been doing something -- something you're not admitting, to yourself or to us -- that was above and beyond what the other players were doing. It's YOUR responsibility to tell us why your flakiness was more annoying to the DM than the other players' flakiness. You could ask the DM why, or you could reflect on it yourself.

As a side note, I want to compliment you on a pretty impressive achievement: you've got SHARK and me agreeing entirely on an issue! That's not easy to do!

Daniel

 

[DarkCrisis]

I can't; only you can. I'm discounting the possibility that your DM has multiple-personality disorder, and that the vindictive Sally was in control when you weren't paying attention, whereas the generous Frank was in control when the others were goofing off.

That means you must have been doing something -- something you're not admitting, to yourself or to us -- that was above and beyond what the other players were doing. It's YOUR responsibility to tell us why your flakiness was more annoying to the DM than the other players' flakiness. You could ask the DM why, or you could reflect on it yourself.

As a side note, I want to compliment you on a pretty impressive achievement: you've got SHARK and me agreeing entirely on an issue! That's not easy to do!

Daniel

I must have? The only thing I was doing was at the last game when I was told I didnt need to be there was before the game started I was talking toa guy the DM hates. The guy and I where talking about 1st ed D&D stuff over near the old books (we play at a game store).

And I did ask the DM when he told me I didnt need to be there he said I shouldnt have missed that session and the other players after the game asked and he said I shouldnt have been reading.

So you still insist that Im hiding something? Fine. I can't prove it to you. I would own up to anything I did hence why I apologised to the DM. I own up to my mistakes. I guess thats why it hurt my feelings to be treated that way. I did nothing to intentially upset him and even apologised for it yet he still did that stuff to me.

But Im sure you will still insist Im hiding something. Nothing I can do will change your mind but I just hate to be told im telling half truths or lying.

 

[Shalewind]

Well I just have to bite on this one.

I have the luxury of gaming with a very close group, thus this changes the dynamics. If my best-friend, so, or family suddenly just didn't show for a game, I'd be pretty upset too. Like Shark said, DMs put a lot into Entertaining... I know I run a storyline heavy game and spend a good 12 hours a week planning or what no. (am I obessed? Perhaps... ) But I like the players to show and be attentive, and they never have a problem because they love it as much as I do.

As for reading during the game... If I'm doing an NPC scene (personal relationship or the like) with just one PC and an NPC, no I don't really care what the other PCs do. They tend to listen because it makes for interesting stuff, I pefer them to listen, but I don't require it. If they constantly read a novel during the game, now that really ticks me off.

As for your DM DC... Well, I don't know if you were out of line (I don't know you or the situation well enough) but it definately sounds like he was. I never kill a PC of mine without them being there. I would also never have a conflict with a new character, because I build the new characters with the PC and think of how to intigrate them. The DM has a lot of responsibility IMO, and on this one, I think yours made a mistake or two.

Good luck with a new group. Remember, friends make better gaming partners than just dudes. Sure, you get to trade more insults, but the RPs better.

 

[jdavis]

Greetings!

Hey Daniel! Your answer was spot on. It's about courtesy and respect.

Doc Moriarty, hey there! No, Daniel isn't my mommy.

Indeed, I realise it is "just a game", however, why is it any different if my friends say, "Yeah, SHARK, we'll be over this Saturday for the barbecue! Break out the food, some good cigars, it'll be great!"

I go and buy food, beer, cigars, good steaks, chips, and what not, get everything planned, and they just decide at the last minute or the day before that they have something better to do? What the eff! Do you see? Well, why is getting together for the game any different? In reality, it isn't any different. We have agreed to get together at such and such time, on such and such day. I expect at least three days notice, if at all possible, if you are gonna cancel. There is in truth a lot of effort put into entertaining, whether its buying the extra soda, getting the steaks ready, picking up a few extra cigars, or whatever. It really doesn't have that much to do with the game at all, so much as it has to do with respecting me as a friend, and being conscientious about making a committment, and sticking to it. On my end, there is a lot of time, energy, and no small amount of money as well being put out for your pleasure and entertainment. I would think that becasue I, as your friend, and as the DM, making the committment that I do to make the game up, and make all the other preparations for our time together, don't you think that I would deserve a similar level of committment, courtesy, and respect from you?

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

Do you have a barbecue every week? Yes he should of cancelled with more notice but if the guy was running adventures from modules that were straight Dungeon crawls then I don't think the guy prepared for hours on end. This was closer to "hey lets hang out at my house", and then one person saying "oh wait I can't make it" nobody was out a bunch of money or time. Lets not forget that in the discription of what's going on other people no showed on a regular basis and he called ahead to miss once.

You stated that you put lots of work into your campaign and expected people to be there, but not every D&D game falls under that catagory. I posted this once and I'll post it again, "It all depends on the group you play with". Your standards are for your game, they are not universal. To some people D&D is a major social event, to others it's just a get together. Some people spend weeks working on indepth modules with tons of roleplaying and character development, some people "hit the orcs". For both sides on this, people play the game different and have different interpretations of what is involved and how the game should be played. Implying that somebody is wrong or bad because they don't share the same views is wrong and just goofy. As long as the group agrees with each other as to how imprtant showing up is that any way is ok. This situation is not about how bad not showing up is but about a DM holding one member to a different standard and taking out his anger by abusing being the DM to kill the guys character and running him off instead of the two of them sitting down and talking about it. If he is wrong for not giving enough notice, then how wrong were the people who missed regularly with out giving any notice? I guess I have fallen firmly on one side of this issue, I agree that he should of paid more attention and he should of tried to give more notice but these are not major "lets end or friendship" issues, these are very minor things, the response was wrong and overblown, especially when a "hey please stop that would of sufficed".

 

[Pielorinho]

And I did ask the DM when he told me I didnt need to be there he said I shouldnt have missed that session and the other players after the game asked and he said I shouldnt have been reading.

But you're saying you don't believe the DM on this score, right? That other players could miss sessions and you couldn't? So what's the difference? I wonder if other players give more notice, or have better reasons for missing a session. Or if other players don't have the "why should I pay attention to his boring descriptions" attitude.

Could be he just doesn't like you. But I know that you're engaging in behaviors that I'd find inappropriate were I running the game, so I'm guessing that that's the basis for his problem. I could be wrong. But I still think that in the future, you'd do well not to read unrelated books while the game is going on, and you'd do well to find out whether cancelling for mood-related reasons is appropriate within a group.

Obviously, in some groups, such behavior is appropriate. Given that your DM told you it wasn't appropriate, though, I'm inclined to believe that you ran up against some very reasonable expectations of behavior in civil, respectful company.

Daniel