So I was more or less kicked out of my D&D group

[FreeTheSlaves]

Oddly enough i find myself in a rather similar position, except for that it was me that threw myself out of one of my gaming groups.

Basically you cut away the bull**** and really it is people gaming with people they normally wouldn't hang out with.

This is in the DMG, Monte says it, common sense screams it and sad experience proves it.

I know that with my existing group it is all fine. Problems pop up but can be talked about because we're friends and these problems are really pretty minor stuff anyway.

Gaming for the sake of gaming with whomever is available does noone any favours eh?

 

[Sixchan]

Too bad. Miss Manners says there are two excuses for missing a social engagement: the death of a close family member, or your own death. "Wanting a quiet evening at home" doesn't qualify.

This is my pet peeve. While some of my adventures don't spotlight particular characters, I do try to arrange storylines so that every PC gets a chance to shine. One session might involve the cleric making a difficult choice between his God and his family. Another evening might be a chance for the shadowdancer to learn more about the mysterious founder of her school of fighting. On a third evening, the adventure might take the shape of the wizard's old rivals showing up in town and raising Cain.

I do this because I think it's fun for the players. And when a player cancels on me at the last minute for a crappy reason (and "I have too much homework" is a crappy reason -- wanting a quiet evening at home is a downright sucky reason), it can ruin my plans for the evening, ruin the scenes and the plot advancement and the stats I've written up and everything..

Perhaps. But in a Dungeon Delving campaign like the one Darkcrisis is playing in, there isn't likely to be something like this. And I think an attitude like that is pretty strict for what is supposed to be a social thing that the Players are under no obligation to come to. One of my players didn't show up for 5 weeks with no better excuse than "oh...I forgot". That is something to get angry about, not someone just wanting a quiet evening at home, which I personally believe that he is completely entitled to, and any group of friends should respect (though I wouldn't call DC's current group his friends).

DarkCrisis, your DM didn't handle your ill behavior with grace or aplomb. But you should consider the following things in the future:
* In a social situation, pay attention to other folks' cues. If they're annoyed at you for not paying attention, try paying attention.

There are limits to this. The game was obviously VERY boring for him, and I can't really blame him for reading.

* Once you make a social commitment, backing out is weaselly and uberlame. Keep the commitment unless somebody dies. If you MUST cancel it, do so with as much notice as you can. (e.g., if your grandmother dies on Sunday, call on Sunday to cancel your Wednesday game).

No offence, but do your players have to sign some sort of contract to get in your game?

* In many RPG groups (mine included), player-knowledge and character-knowledge are kept separate. The characters don't know that the new forsaker is played by the same guy who played the dead rogue; the players therefore would be perilously close to cheating if they gave all the rogue's loot to the forsaker.

There are also groups that divide the loot up out of character, giving gold to players who contributed most. Just as an alternate example.

* In many RPG groups (mine included), people with new characters enter at a lower level than folks with current characters. This is a small reward for people who help story continuity by keeping the same character over the long haul.

Yeah, but it was the DM who killed his character. The DM forced him down two levels.

* In many RPG groups (mine included), people are expected to create characters that can work well within the group. Your choice of a Forsaker may have been inadvertent; once you realized that you weren't going to be able to participate in the group, it would've been a good idea to create a different PC.

I think the DM should be the one that says before play that a character might not work. He did realise he couldn't participate in the group, so (quite rightly) he left.

I'm sorry you had such an unpleasant experience. I do think that you can make some changes in your gaming behavior that'll help you avoid such experiences in the future.

Daniel

I don't really think he did anything wrong. IMO, of course.


DarkCrisis, you did the right thing. That DM was a complete ****** who **** and ******* all ***** day long. (nope, those stars don't really stand for anything, but it's the thought that counts)

 

[Voneth]

As far as your GM's policy to deal with things in game instead of hashing things out out of game. I just had an example this week.

I run a d20 Farscape game at a game store. In order to deal with those who have never seen the show, I say they have to start off as an astrounaut of some sort from Earth (they can be commando, scientist, or whatever.)

This kid wanted to play and said he that saw the show. Then he said he wanted to play a vampire. I asked him some trivia questions, which he failed miserably. I told him he had to go (he he could find another game to play at the store.) Did he think I was jerk, hell yes. But the story continues.

Next week, he came back and tried to give me a hard time for "having no life" becuase he couldn't answer the questions. (Like naming any of the characters from the show.) I told him to quit pulling my leg. He left for half an hour. He came back again and then started to make a human psychic. (Still a stretch, but I allowed it.) So the end result?

The kid turned out to be a better role player than some regulars and he actualy enjoyed the game and admitted he knew a lot less than he let on. If he comes back next week, he's got a spot at my table. Everything was up front and when the kid was serious about gaming, he knew the rules and abidded by them and we all had a great time.

And I can see how you are confused about the hypocrital behavior that your GM had about you reading d20Modern compared to CCG chat. But I think it was pretty much the usual "social gamer hypocrite" behavior.

I assume most everyone at your old table played Warlord. Heck, at my GM's table the chat is about Everquest and L5R, two games that I don't play, and they even talk football. Yet I know if I stuck my nose in a book of a rpg game no one else played, then suddenly I had better look like I was somewhat paying attention. If it was something like a comic book, that would be a no no.

Is it rude to my gaming experience that they talk about other games, yes. But the unspoken "social contract" is since I am out numbered at the table, I have to put up with it. Heck, I used to get people rolling their eyes when I talked about DnD psionics until a new player brought at psy warrior to the table.

 

[Voneth]

Too bad. Miss Manners says there are two excuses for missing a social engagement: the death of a close family member, or your own death. "Wanting a quiet evening at home" doesn't qualify.

I do this because I think it's fun for the players. And when a player cancels on me at the last minute for a crappy reason (and "I have too much homework" is a crappy reason -- wanting a quiet evening at home is a downright sucky reason), it can ruin my plans for the evening, ruin the scenes and the plot advancement and the stats I've written up and everything.
Daniel

I can feel your pain Pielorinho. My advice, never run a game at a game store. You will be frothing at the mouth at the end of the month.

I play in a group that is composed of parents, self-employed game designers and foot ball freaks. If we never played until everyone showed up on time, we would never get any gaming done. However we know when some people will show up and others call if they have to cancel. The only thing that ususaly stops the game is when the GM can't be there. And sometimes he even doesn't tell us he's not showing up.

 

[blackshirt5]

I do this because I think it's fun for the players. And when a player cancels on me at the last minute for a crappy reason (and "I have too much homework" is a crappy reason -- wanting a quiet evening at home is a downright sucky reason), it can ruin my plans for the evening, ruin the scenes and the plot advancement and the stats I've written up and everything.

Wow, I'd hate to play in your group. I just had to cancel on my players(I'm the DM) because I've got too much homework.

And everybody is entitled to a mental health day once in a while, where they just kinda chill out alone in their domicile.

 

[mythago]

Miss Manners says there are two excuses for missing a social engagement: the death of a close family member, or your own death.

Air your peeves all you like, but don't stoop to misrepresenting Miss Manners--who, as far as I'm aware, has never chided people for bowing out of social engagements due to the kids coming down with 103-degree fevers, or onself having an extremely contagious cold. Both of these are way short of death, but Miss Manners (and, I hope, you) would consider them perfectly fine excuses for cancelling a social commitment.

As a GM, I agree with you that players need to think about their impact on the group. Bowing out at the last minute can mess up the game for other people, and doing that because you feel like staying home and flaking is pretty rude.

But I didn't say that was OK. My point was only that another poster had mistakenly claimed DarkCrisis was a no-show when he had, in fact, called ahead.

BTW, I also think killing off a character with no notice for a first offense is pathetic. Giving a warning, telling the guy not to bother showing up for the next session--sure. But waiting to greet the player next time with "You're dead! Roll up a new PC!" is just lame.

if he's got something more important to do than play the game what can I do?

Tell him he can forget about being included in any major plotlines or adventures. It's understandable when people have to bow out from time to time, but when the game becomes "if I have nothing better to do," then as a GM I will expend a similar amount of consideration on trying to entertain that player. Which is to say, not much.

What is this "girlfriend or wife" thing anyway? Everyone should spend time with their family, but the day I tell my GM that I can't come to game because my husband is being pouty about it, will be the day my gaming buds stage an intervention.

 

[Gizzard]

There are limits to this. The game was obviously VERY boring for him, and I can't really blame him for reading.

This is kinda what I read between the lines in his original story.

Everyone else is having fun and talking about other stuff they care about, he is the odd man out. Since he's the odd man and not having a good time it showed in what he did at the table. When the DM called him on it, he missed the social cue and responded defensively - "Hey, why cant I read? You guys do stuff that bores me all the time." Hmm, now its one of those "me vs. you" things where the battle lines are the reading player on one side and pretty much everyone else who likes to chat about CCGs on the other. Not a good situation for our hero.

How many threads have I seen on this board where a DM complained about a player and the vast majority said, "Give him da boot!"? Although killing someones character when they arent there is completely lame, I interpreted it as just a passive-aggressive form of "da Boot!" Completely uncalled for, but I bet that if the DM in question were to post his version of events that we could get a majority of posters supporting him.

 

[Teflon Billy]

...And I didn't just decide to skip. I finally got the house to myself and wanted a quiet evening for a change. Is that so wrong? I even explained to the DM that I rarely get privacy now-a-days and having the house to myself for a night was awesome...

How is that different from deciding to skip?

 

[boschdevil]

Oh, I support the DM is this situation without even having to listen to his side of the story.

First item, the reading (skimming) of the book during gaming. We had one of the players do something like during during our adventure. Well, our characters got surprised by some hobgoblins (or some monster like that. I has been a while) and the DM tells us to roll initiative. Well, all of the sudden, the player startles out of his chair say, "What's hapenning!!!" As another player, I told him that he would know if he was paying attention. If you don't want to pay attention, that's fine. Just don't expect the others who are paying attention and the DM to explain things again. I think he got the point.

Second, as a DM, I give the players five seconds to tell me what they are doing. If they don't start explaining what they are doing, then their character misses a round. And I'm not the only DM in my group that does this. If you want to not pay attention and know what your character is exactly going to do, then peruse other books to your hearts content. Just don't expect me to explain the present situation during the combat round because you chose not to pay attention.

Third, our group takes the approach that it has to be something pretty important to miss a group meeting. We all are taking time out of our schedules to dedicate for the gaming night. All of the people in my gaming group really don't live too close to one another. Thus, it wouldn't take long for everyone in the group to become irate because others felt they wanted to do another activity that night. How would you feel if you really couldn't run an effective session because the others just didn't fell like showing up that night? How about if you drove over to the DM place, only for him to say, "You know. I'd rather not tonight."? I work full time as an engineer and am taking graduate classes, which severely limits my free time. If I can make time for my wife and still play D&D, I think anyone can. It's all about budgeting time.

Fourth, what is with the statement, "Well I'm a rogue and there weren't any traps ..."? Half of the stuff my character does has nothing to do with my class. Hence, I'm paying attention all of the time.

Finally, I really hope he didn't expect that there would be a mass exodus from him group after (a) choosing to not pay attention and skim books and (b) choosing not to show up (even with notice). The best thing is that he and his DM don't have to deal with one another. Personally, it sounds like the DM got the better part of the deal.

 

[DarkCrisis]

Perhaps I should explain a few things

1. There are 8 people in the group plus the DM. 4 of which pay Warlord 2 play Magic. Game got held up a lot for CCG discussions

2. I had always gone to the games unlike 2 other players who just go missing for 2-5 sessions. Do they get reprimanded? No. Why is my one evening off (which I called about) differnt?

3. Almost everyone agrees that the game is boring except the DM who has said "He bought these modules and is going to use them"

4. I really had nothing to do except when I needed to check for traps or in a fight. If there was some actual RPing I'd been all about it.

5. Yes I was reading. Just like 2 others will talk about non game related stuff while we are playing. or they will all stop the game to talk about CCGs or painting figs or whatever. Point being I may have been annoying the DM but I was by far not the biggest disturbance the game has ever seen.

6. I wasn't totally ignoring the game. I can hear him talking while I read.

7. What made me mad was I am apparently held up to higher standards than the other members.

I can't miss a session (calling 1st) while others can just not show up.

I cant skim a book while others can talk amonst themselves or paint or also read a book.

8. I'm not mad about not getting some treasure I was mad cause my Rogue was wrongfully killed off thus not allowing me to advance. I lost a 7 lvl Rogue which would have had over 60,000gp worth of treasure (plus the items on it) in exchage for a 5th level character.

9. I told him I wasthining of playing a Forsaker and he said okay. He had the chance to say no.

10. The DM has admitted to being a vengeful person. If he feels wronged then he will casue you grief. I guess I wronged him.

11. The other members of the group thought that what he did was wrong (I talked to one of them). 2 or thinking of starting a new game cause they are tired of the DMs boring dungeon crawls and for last Fridays actions.

12. one of the members asked the DM why he did that and he said I shouldn't have been readind (3 weeks ago) apparently that is what made him kill my character (when I was gone) and make playing my new character suck.

Any more questions please ask