So... What have you heard about the Dungeons & Dragons Online game?

[Jupp]

BioWare has stuck to the D&D rules in its games?

The only software company to get D&D "right" was SSI.

Up to now there has been no software company that got the rules right in their computer games. Neither SSI nor Troika or Bioware. But thats mainly because you cannot really translate PnP rules into a CRPG. Even 3E, which was initially praised to have the best rules suited for computer games has failed in that respect. I think the game that came closest to the rules was ToEE, but even they had to bow to the fact that you cannot emulate the rules 1:1. There always had to be a trade-off so far. Personally I really do not care that much since there will be a huge difference between PnP and computer games for quite some time into the future. It's all about round based combat and some certain feats and skill that just cannot work in a CRPG.

Edit: And if you go from round based to real time you have other things you will loose due to that change...

 

[Spatula]

Oh, I forgot about Troika. They get points for trying to do 3E right with ToEE (not totally their fault the result was so buggy), rather than taking some homebrew system and grafting 3E onto it like Bioware.

 

[TheAuldGrump]

Oh, I forgot about Troika. They get points for trying to do 3E right with ToEE (not totally their fault the result was so buggy), rather than taking some homebrew system and grafting 3E onto it like Bioware.

They also played D&D on a weekly basis before they got hired to do the game.

I am incredibly bummed that they have closed their doors - I have liked just about everything that they have done...

The Auld Grump

 

[Aristotle]

2) The computer, by contrast, can juggle all of this stuff and allow us to see the results instantly. Expecting a pen-and-paper RPG experience in a real-time 3D computer RPG is, well, not very realistic.

Just to make sure we are on the same page, "twitch" tends to mean that the game play has some dependency on the reflexes/speed of the player. A faster player will generally beat out a slower one regardless of the character's abilities in a pure twitch game (most first person shooters). I don't think most of us expect a turn based game. That would be rediculous. But most of your more popular MMOs (WoW, EverQuest, FFXI, etc..) have actively stayed away from twitch gaming.

I don't know how twitchy D&D will be. This is the first I've heard of it. But it's a fine line for me, and if the game crosses it I won't be buying in. If I want twitch, I'll load the latest version of Unreal Tournament.

 

[Storyteller01]

I think the 'twitch' factor is using the terrain and mobiltiy to your advantage (same as tabletop; you decide where the players go).

Once you make contact (attack/swing/shoot/whatever), the computer figures tha BaB to AC and decides who hits and who doesn't.Jusy because you touched doesn't mean you hit. Character skill is also going to determine attack speed.

I'll hold my opinion until I see the game.

 

[takyris]

Oh, I forgot about Troika. They get points for trying to do 3E right with ToEE (not totally their fault the result was so buggy), rather than taking some homebrew system and grafting 3E onto it like Bioware.

So, the attack rolls, the saving throws, the skill checks, the vast majority of feats and spells that they included in the game, those were just something they planned for something else and then went, "Hey, gosh, I guess we could get this to look a bit like the d20 system!", by your story?

Don't get me wrong. I'd love to see a game where rogues got to climb, monks got to use Slow Fall, and wizards got the bevy of spells that are a pain in the butt to implement in a CRPG environment. But this statement is perhaps the teensiest smidge on the unreasonable side, given the limitations of the technology they were working with in combination with the fact that they were trying to make a mod-friendly game.

 

[Spatula]

So, the attack rolls, the saving throws, the skill checks, the vast majority of feats and spells that they included in the game, those were just something they planned for something else and then went, "Hey, gosh, I guess we could get this to look a bit like the d20 system!", by your story?

Don't get me wrong. I'd love to see a game where rogues got to climb, monks got to use Slow Fall, and wizards got the bevy of spells that are a pain in the butt to implement in a CRPG environment. But this statement is perhaps the teensiest smidge on the unreasonable side, given the limitations of the technology they were working with in combination with the fact that they were trying to make a mod-friendly game.

Take a look at the ToEE game sometime. Talking about climbing, falling, etc. is red herring, because no D&D CRPG has ever allowed that level of free-form playing experience. Bioware's changes to the rules are their own invention, and, generally speaking, not a result of being unable to model something in a CRPG environment. The engine behind NWN was originally meant for something else, as I recall, and was adapted to 3E after the fact, which is why you're left with the non-D&D oddities in the game.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Bummer about the no-shifters thing. I like shifters.

But I can understand how that would have been an absolute killer to script. "Okay, now we need a script for how the guard acts if he sees you pretending to be Lord Noordis after ANOTHER shifter pretending to be Lord Noordis has already entered the building, and can we combine that with the script for if you currently look like Ordinary Guard? No, two separate scripts? Alrighty, then. Shifters are out."

< spanish accent >
I don't think you mean what you think you mean
</ spanish accent >

Changelings perhaps? Those sneaky tricksters, they even keep changing their name!

 

[Dinkeldog]

Some good, some bad. My preferred classes and races for Eberron look like they're not going to be implemented definitely in the initial release, and probably not forever. My primary character right now is a shifter psychic warrior. I liked that Eberron placed an emphasis on including psionics. Too bad DDO is killing both that and the shifter.

Still, it'll probably get at least a trial.

 

[takyris]

Changeling, of course. Duh. My bad. Shifters are the "My grandmother was one-quarter werewolf" types, yes? (Okay, true-breeding, I know, but it's a good line.)