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SoIaF: R+L=J? (Serious Spoiler Discussion)

Steel_Wind

Legend
Ok, This is a topic which is speculation on the major character in GRRM's Song of Ice and Fire.

It is a MAJOR SERIOUS SPOILER. For those not interested, please - you have been warned.

The Spoiler concerns speculation I read on a forum administered by Westeros.org. In a nutshell, it theorizes on who the actual mother of Jon Snow is.

Having read it, I had a major AHAAA! moment and I believe it is correct.

The theory is pretty simple:

1 - Read carefully. Eddard never says to Catelyn that Jon is his son; he says that Jon is "his blood";
2- Catelyn is angry that Eddard kept the boy because of Eddard's love for Jon's mother. She is correct, but not in the way she thinks.
3- Jon Snow's mother was, in fact, Lyanna Stark
4 - Jon is not Eddard's son. He is the son of Prince Rhaegar Targaryen
5 - Lyanna was not raped by Raeghar - Lyann loved Prince Rhaegar. They may have married in secret and this was involved in the reason for Brandon's execution by Aerys.
6- Eddard's promise to Lyanna was not to bring her back to Winterfell, but to save the life of her son
7- re-read the scene where Littlefinger brings Eddard to the brothel (the second time) to see where the speculation over "the price that Eddard paid" for keeping Lyanna's secret is directly joined ot the issue of bastards. Rhaegar is mentioned a page later - for no good reason other than to link the two
8 - Eddard's' journey in the War to unseat Aerys moves from the Trident, to King's Landing to Storm's End and at last to Lyanna. And Rhaegar killed her? Many months after he was dead at the Trident? Not likely.
9 - Her bed was scented with flowers and she died clutching the flowers Rhaegar put in her hair at the Tourney. Come on! She loved him!
10 - Lyanna knew Robert would never remain faithful to her. Robert is repeatedly observed by Eddard to believe the things he wanted to believe. Lyanna was not raped and did not love Robert.
11 - Jon and Dany seem destined for one another in some way. Even though Dany is his aunt, she is his junior - or - alternatively - they were born at about the same time - perhaps even on the same night.
12 - Jon as a Targaryen will eventually take one of Dany's dragons as his own.
13 - Benjen - who is not dead (or at least, only mostly dead) knows the truth as Eddard told him. From this source - it will eventually be revealed to Jon - probably some time after Jon and Dany have met and fallen in love.
14 - If he was a legitimate heir, Jon Snow was Prince Rhaegar 's true born heir and is the rightful heir to the throne of the Seven Kingdoms; His life was also forfeit almost immediately if found out - explaining why Eddard would to the world proclaim himself foresworn in his marriage vows even when it was not so;
15- Eddard Stark never ever broke a vow. NEVER Why believe he broke his marriage vow?
16 - Melisandre's obsession about the blood of a True King will ultimately involve Jon and perhaps hint at his parentage


Comments?
 
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Yes.

Since you put SPOILERS in the title, I'm forgoing the the hidden text and jumping right in.

I'm sure that's where this is going. The real question is...what will Jon do about it?

Will he ditch his irritatingly stupid blind sense of duty and actually become a likable character once he realizes that his whole life has been a lie?
(And if he does feel slighted, and start seeking vengeance and conquest in the Targaryen name, will all his reader fans still think he's the good guy?)

Or will he try to be even more obnoxiously honorable and not make the same mistakes as others. In which case I will go hang myself in disbelief.

Whichever way Jon goes, I just hope he dies a gruesome end, and if this series does wind up with a happily ever after (I hope not) it belongs to Jon and (or?) Danys kid.
 

All signs point to yes ;)

Another strong piece of evidence is from Dany's vision of the blue flower on the wall.

A blue flower grew from a chink in a wall of ice, and filled the air with sweetness.

Lyanna loved the blue flowers, and Jon is at the wall. The only problem I see with this theory is that it's been gone over so much in the years since the last book, that many people know about it and take it as fact. I can see this giving GRRM fuel to pull the rug out from under us all, but it would take some clever explanation to still fit all the clues we've seen so far.


Edit:
Oh just wanted to add that Howland Reed also presumably knows the truth, since he was at the Tower of Joy with Eddard.
 
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It's also when Eddard thinks of his vow while sitting in the prison cell, which would make no sense if the vow to Lyanna only entailed getting her to Winterfell. Also, everybody (except Robert, who had a "slanted view") talks about Rhaegar as a true knight, an honorable and dashing man, not a crazy dictator-to-be. Such a man would have no reason to take Lyanna by force.

Jon even looks like Lyanna. There are some theories I'm not sure about, but Jon being a Targaryen is what I believe 100%.
 


Although I agree with your ideas about the mother (never could figure out the father), everything else you have here would be really, really cool if true.
 

Berandor said:
Jon even looks like Lyanna. There are some theories I'm not sure about, but Jon being a Targaryen is what I believe 100%.

Yes. GRRM gives this tidbit to us when Eddard tells Arya that she looks like Lyanna.

GRRM again hints that there is something up here by explaining that Arya questioned Catelyn if she was really her daughter. Catelyn laughs and assures her she is and that "Arya Horse face" just took after the Starks - not the Tullys - in her looks.

Jon is described a few times as looking like Arya. We must put the two together to reach == Jon looks like Lyanna.
 

stevelabny said:
Yes.


Will he ditch his irritatingly stupid blind sense of duty and actually become a likable character once he realizes that his whole life has been a lie?


Jon's since of duty and honor are the reasons why he is one of the few characters in the whole series I actually like.
 

The first part I definately agree with. Jon and Dany falling in love I'm not sure so positive about. From Dany's perpective, how is Jon any different from one of the usurpers?

I see them as potential rivals.
 

ssampier said:
The first part I definately agree with. Jon and Dany falling in love I'm not sure so positive about. From Dany's perpective, how is Jon any different from one of the usurpers?

I see them as potential rivals.

No doubt it may be presented as such.

Jon is different because - if true - Jon is not the Usurper - Dany is. Primogeniture applies and his claim is better than hers.

The Dragon blood would prove the truth of it; moreover, a deal with Jon (i.e. marriage) will be to her overall advantage.

Somehow I expect - by the time of the Long Night - Westeros will have bigger fish to fry :)
 

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