Sooo, that's my players certain not to be subscribing to DDI...

[Imban]

It is my impression that the 'Rules Database' does not contain the full rules like many people here seem to expect, but rather only the names of the various feats, powers, etc - their actual descriptions and mechanics will still be contained in the books.

Supposedly, you get the full rules if you're a subscriber and the names (and possibly descriptions) even if you're not a subscriber.

 

[Simplicity]

I'll consider getting it as a DM, but it'll be totally useless for all of my players. I won't be able to game using the gaming table since none of them will be likely to subscribe to this at any price. It's just the way of D&D. DMs shell out the cash for the game, players bring the snacks.

Now, I may be able to use a single laptop gaming table set up... We'll see. The price is very high though. LotRO is on par, and required a heck of a lot more technical expertise to create. I could subscribe to a magazine for this price. I could get a premium cable channel.

I think that WotC may be aiming too high if this is their target price. Cut the features, and bring the price down, and it'll get more people signed up.

 

[EricNoah]

In my situation, would I feel $10 a month? Not at all. We subscribe to Netflix and maybe watch 3 DVDs a month max. I pay something like that for my audiobook subscriptions. Price for me is a non-issue.

I would not use the virtual table at all. I would probably use the Dungeon/Dragon content and would very much use the rules database. But the main dealbreaker (or maker) for me would be how good the character generator is. If it was awesome, it would be well worth the price for me. If it is less than awesome ... I would have a hard time justifying the expenditure for the other stuff.

 

[Primal]

Are you serious?? The value is FANTASTIC.

For a subscription you get full Dungeon and Dragon content, I think they said 160 pages a month. All for a price LESS than what I paid per year when the print mags still existed.

So already you are ahead.

Yep, *print* mags... I think there's a world of difference between reading a print mag and an electronic mag. Plus, the former is easier on your eyes. Now, if I wanted to print them myself (to actually *use* that content in a campaign) I need to dish out about 25 USD per *magazine* for BW print-outs (at my local library -- it has the cheapest prices in my home town). Or, I could buy a printer and a new ink cartridge for each issue. In the end, both ways cost about the same. How am I going to be "ahead"?

 

[Spatula]

As for Dungeon and Dragon, do you know how much I paid for them? $0 a year. So the value they have to me? Very close to $0, because I wasn't buying them because they didn't help me in any meaningful way. There's no reason to believe 4E will change that.

So, previously you had no use for extra D&D material. And now you're saying that you're unwilling to pay for extra D&D material. That you have no use for.

I am, I must say, shocked.

As someone who has paid for Dungeon (not so much Dragon), and uses the online SRD extensively, I have to say that DDI is looking to be a great value. Dungeon was around $6-7 a month... so I can get that, plus Dragon, plus the rules database, plus all the other things (that I'm not so interested in, personally), for $3? I have spoken disparaginly of the idea of simply giving us PDFs of rulebooks as part of DDI in the past, so the new approach is both a pleasant surprise and a damn incredible value. For $10 a month, you get every rulebook published by WOTC (or at least the rules portion thereof), plus all the other junk (Dragon, Dungeon, etc.).

If you have no desire for adventures, extra rule materials, and online rulebooks, well of course DDI isn't a good value.

 

[Nahat Anoj]

I was pretty sure I was going to give the DDI a try before hearing this. Most of the places I game at have wireless internet access, and I often use my laptop while I game. Usually this is to keep track of monsters or reference an adventure I've written.

Now the rules database has me *really* intrigued. That's a lot of value - I don't have to spend $30 a month to keep caught up - just $10. I use a Mac, and while I don't get access to the virtual gaming table, this is still pretty sweet IMO. But admittedly, $120 for a year feels steep. But I also play D&D often ...

I can also let other people use my password. If they need to, they can get on and check out stuff. Hell, we could split the costs - if me and my bud want to, he could pay $60 and I could pay $60. We *both* have access to all the rules. Of course, I would do this only if I knew the person wasn't a douche bag, but I know plenty of people who are trustworthy and would be up for this.

So it's looking like a darn good deal. I honestly don't think anyone should simply dismiss this out of hand. It might even open up a new business model for game stores - get wireless internet, stock your store with a bunch of gaming aids and snacks, and let people play D&D by accessing the rules from the data base. If they really like one of the books they find online, they can buy a dead tree version in your store.

Maybe a game store might even buy access for the entire store, letting everyone use the login (either for a price or for free). There's some interesting things on the horizon ...

EDIT - I actually suspect that the terms of service might limit how many people can use an account. We shall have to wait and see.

 

[Ridley's Cohort]

Looks like a truly awesome deal...for those who were happy to pony up for paper magazines in the past.

For most others, it seems like a highly debatable value.

I will probably try it for one month -- I am curious.

 

[mattcolville]

My group are all adults, they all have jobs, none of us are living on ramen noodle, I don't think any of them would bat an eye at this. Especially given the desperate need for e-support we've suffered through.

 

[dm4hire]

I have to count myself among the dissenting on this as I mentioned in a couple of other threads. Too many strikes against it for me to believe it will work in the long run. It might be popular during the free period and when 4e first releases but I think it will wane after that.

1. If I don't like what's in Dragon/Dungeon on a newsstand I can skip that issue for the month; no such luck with this option. Subscriptions for both magazines for a year weren't even that high if I remember correctly as they tended to be discounted by 35-40% except for outside the U.S. to which then yes it's a good deal.

2. The miniatures are not included in the expense. If they include the actual miniature in the cost of buying the online version it would be worth it to pay for them online as I'd know what I were getting versus buying mixed boxes. Need 20 orcs, skeletons, whatever then I buy them for both online and at home.

3. Content updates have been decent, if not exceptional, but will the consistency hold up? What if something happens at the company that causes a delay in content? Will we be reimbursed for the lack of it?

4. Access is subject to a number of things, i.e. server maintenance, band width usage, your computer's capabilities, hacker attacks (it can happen and when it does it causes the first one), availability to the internet where I play, and various other things I can't think of at the moment.

5. Personal time availability may not justify the cost either. I play only once a month or so it's too expensive, but if I know I'll use it more than once per week it might justify the expense. Will all that play time be online? Will I have access to the internet where I play?

6. The prices are similar to an MMO, which offers more in the sense, that if I can't get together with a group I can still play on my own. For younger players who would be relying upon their parents to pay the fee it's another justification they have to make and a parent will most likely look at the expense of two online things as starting to get expensive and would probably draw a line. Either the MMO or DDI, sorry but the MMO will win.

7. Playing with groups outside my own requires them to accept me. This acceptance is subject to their decision, any possible reputation I might have or don't have. I doubt WotC will force people to let someone join a group. I also run the risk of playing with people I don't want to play with and most prefer not to pay to play with players they don't like. Also players I don't like can change their names and join up again (I know this would require some work on their part, but irl I see the person and know if it’s someone I don’t want to play with).

8. If I buy all the books I am paying twice for them. Why am I only gaining access to what I purchase? I'd think if anything, buying a book would entitle me to a free month, which would encourage sales of products. They could also build the cost into the products I am purchasing; a small price increase of fifty cents to a dollar going toward web maintenance would go unnoticed. The $120, if I do a year subscription would buy at least four more books that I actually would use. Where I might not use the stuff anyway as there was a reason why I didn't buy it to begin with.

9. I still think advertising would be the best way for WotC to make money off of the service and just keep it free. Major companies in computer gaming would pay big money to advertise, not to mention soda companies and such.

10. As for the extra features of DDI, such as gaming table, miniatures, and other stuff not mentioned, a good retail program for a quarter or half the price would work, minus the online play ability but that is only a step away. What if someone comes up with a similar idea and does it for less or free? People have been playing online with tools in chat rooms and other methods for a long time. WotC can't copy right or patent the idea for online table gaming as it has been around for a long time already and I can't do that with ideas any way, only the way it’s done or presented. (An example for this is one of the jelly companies has a patent on the peanut butter and jelly sandwich, not on the actual idea of that kind of sandwich, but on how they make their specific sandwich to be sold.) If another company decides to make a generic program which could be tied directly to D&D by use of its tools then that competition would mean the price needs to go down or go away depending on how much of an impact said product might cause.

 

[Mishihari Lord]

I suspect that they're benchmarking World of Warcraft, which also costs $15 per month, and I also suspect that this is not targeted at long-time RPG players. I can see the appeal: "So it's kind of like WOW, I play it online with people from all over, but I can do literally anything? That's pretty cool!"

The question of course is whether they can bring these types of new players in without strong support from current tabletop players. I would guess that they're hoping to get enough support from current players to bring in a critical mass of new online-only players.