• NOW LIVE! Into the Woods--new character species, eerie monsters, and haunting villains to populate the woodlands of your D&D games.

Special Conversion Thread: Tasked Genies

Perfect Liar is perfect! ;)

Ok, just the basics first, then.
Solipsism
Illusion (Shadow)
Class & level???
...

I like the idea of it creating wall of stone or wall of iron to serve as bridges and the like, so probably about 6th level as it's not that effective in combat.

Sorcerer/Wizard or Cleric?
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Well, it already has misdirection; how was that different from delude back in the day?

Cleon said:
I would prefer the solipsism to be obviously fake and creatures have to deliberately want to believe in it to make it "real", something enemies are unlikely to do.
That is what the "Will save to believe" means; you have to specifically try to make a Will save to believe. I don't think it's meant to be a direct damage or even area-control spell in combat, more of a utility spell. I'll agree with the wall spells as comparison. How about both sorc/wiz and cleric?
 

Well, it already has misdirection; how was that different from delude back in the day?

I'd have to look it up. I could have sworn AD&D misdirection was a spell that messed up your navigation - e.g. you cast it on someone and when they think they're turning left at a fork they're really turning right. Could be mixing that up with another spell, though - maybe the reverse of find the path?

That is what the "Will save to believe" means; you have to specifically try to make a Will save to believe. I don't think it's meant to be a direct damage or even area-control spell in combat, more of a utility spell. I'll agree with the wall spells as comparison. How about both sorc/wiz and cleric?

Sounds like we're on the same wavelength then.

So, up to 6th level conjuration/summonings?

How's this for a start:

Solipsism
Illusion (Shadow)
Level: Sor/Wiz 6
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: See text
Effect: See text
Duration: Concentration
Saving Throw: Will disbelief (Special, see text)
Spell Resistance: Yes; see text

You use material from the Plane of Shadow to shape quasi-real illusions of one or more creatures, objects, or forces. Solipsism can mimic any sorcerer or wizard conjuration (summoning) or conjuration (creation) spell of 6th level or lower, except its duration is as long as the caster concentrates. The illusory objects, forces, or creatures created by solipsism appear to be transparent images superimposed on vague, shadowy forms.

Solipsism is the opposite of normal illusions in that creatures must make an active effort to believe (rather than disbelieve) in the illusion to be affected by it. The spell has no effect on those who do not believe. The objects and creatures "conjured" by solipsism become real to those who believe in them, with all the normal properties their form and function allow. Thus, a solipsistic wall of stone bridging a chasm could be crossed by the caster and those who believed. All others would see the caster apparently walking out onto nothingness. Likewise, a solipsistic summon monster spell can create a creature that can carry believers on its back, or attack believers to cause real damage.

The caster of solipsism automatically believes in the reality of their solipsistic illusions. Other characters must deliberately try to believe in the illusion and succeed at a DC 16 Will save to be affected by this spell. They can substitute a Concentration check for this Will save. A failed save means the character cannot convince themselves of the illusion's reality and the solipsism has no effect on them. A character can make a single attempt to believe each round.

Once they successfully believe in the solipsism, believers will continue to be affected by its "conjurations" as long as they maintain their concentration. The illusion instantly becomes insubstantial if their concentration is broken, they must succeed at the Will save again to "re-believe". Believers can automatically stop believing in the solipsism as a free action.

Objects automatically fail their Will saves against this spell.
 

Shouldn't the DC be 10+spell level+ability modifier as usual? I also think only the caster should need to maintain concentration, based on the original text.
 

Shouldn't the DC be 10+spell level+ability modifier as usual? I also think only the caster should need to maintain concentration, based on the original text.

Problem with that approach is it means the better the caster is (e.g. the higher their ability modifier) the more difficult it is for "believers" to gain the benefit of the spell. I thought about making it DC 10 plus spell level minus ability modifier), but decided that would make the DC too trivial. In the end I just went for 10+spell level.

I even wondered about having a "minus Wisdom modifier" on the saves to believe, so the gullible are more likely to benefit from solipsism.

I also think only the caster should need to maintain concentration, based on the original text.

The "Duration: Concentration" covers all the necessary rules for that. I did think about including it in the body text as well, just to be explicit.
 

We have precedent for static DCs in spells, so I'm fine with leaving it at DC 16. I'd prefer to leave off the option to substitute the Concentration check, though, as there is no chance of failure once the skill is high enough (while the save always allows for a natural 1 failure).
 

See, I don't like the static DC since it makes it too easy for enemies to believe as well. I think one of the main points is for allies to be able to join in as much as possible, while big brutish monsters can't. Of course, the party fighter is left out, but anyway...

My point about Concentration is that I don't think additional believers should have to Concentrate to keep on believin'. Once they make their save, that should be until the spell ends.
 

We have precedent for static DCs in spells, so I'm fine with leaving it at DC 16. I'd prefer to leave off the option to substitute the Concentration check, though, as there is no chance of failure once the skill is high enough (while the save always allows for a natural 1 failure).

That sounds logical, let's leave off the Concentration substitution.
 

See, I don't like the static DC since it makes it too easy for enemies to believe as well. I think one of the main points is for allies to be able to join in as much as possible, while big brutish monsters can't. Of course, the party fighter is left out, but anyway...

There would be very few occasions when that would benefit the enemy. Believing in solipsistic creatures means the enemy can attack the creatures, but it also means the creatures can attack back. The caster of solipsism will be in control of the creatures as if they're summoned monsters, so they'd have to use charm monster spells or the like to take control of them. Even if they do manage to take control, the wizard can just stop concentrating on the solipsism. The wizard can do the same for solipsistic objects, which would prove inconvenient if the enemies were chasing the party over a solipsistic bridge or the like.

Hmm, should we allow the wizard to stop concentrating on one element of a solipsism (e.g. a single creature) while continuing to concentrate on the rest?

My point about Concentration is that I don't think additional believers should have to Concentrate to keep on believin'. Once they make their save, that should be until the spell ends.

That would match the original spell description, so I don't mind changing it.

Revising...

Solipsism
Illusion (Shadow)
Level: Sor/Wiz 6
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: See text
Effect: See text
Duration: Concentration
Saving Throw: Will disbelief (Special, see text)
Spell Resistance: Yes; see text

You use material from the Plane of Shadow to shape quasi-real illusions of one or more creatures, objects, or forces. Solipsism can mimic any sorcerer or wizard conjuration (summoning) or conjuration (creation) spell of 6th level or lower, except its duration is as long as the caster concentrates. The illusory objects, forces, or creatures created by solipsism appear to be transparent images superimposed on vague, shadowy forms.

Solipsism is the opposite of normal illusions in that creatures must make an active effort to believe (rather than disbelieve) in the illusion to be affected by it. The spell has no effect on those who do not believe. The objects and creatures "conjured" by solipsism become real to those who believe in them, with all the normal properties their form and function allow. Thus, a solipsistic wall of stone bridging a chasm could be crossed by the caster and those who believed. All others would see the caster apparently walking out onto nothingness. Likewise, a solipsistic summon monster spell can create a creature that can carry believers on its back, or attack believers to cause real damage.

The caster of solipsism automatically believes in the reality of their solipsistic illusions. Other characters must deliberately try to believe in the illusion and succeed at a DC 16 Will save to be affected by this spell. A failed save means the character cannot convince themselves of the illusion's reality and the solipsism has no effect on them. A character can make a single attempt to believe each round.

Once they successfully believe in the solipsism, believers will continue to be affected by its "conjurations" for the duration of the spell. Believers can automatically stop believing in the solipsism as a free action, but if they do so and decide to "re-believe" they need to succeed at the Will save again. The effects of solipsism continue for as long as the spell's caster maintains concentration. The caster can dissolve discrete elements of the illusion (e.g. a single creature out of a group, or one arrow in a quiver, but not part of a single object or creature) while continuing to concentrate on the rest of the solipsism, but such dissolved elements can not be re-believed into pseudo-existence except by casting the spell again.

Objects automatically fail their Will saves against this spell.
 


Into the Woods

Remove ads

Top