[Spell Compendium] Ray of Light

[Twowolves]

6th level spell. Hmmm, I could blind the guy for 1d4 rounds, or I could Disintegrate him. Or I could make myself immune to spells under 5th level. Or I could Silently Teleport. Nah, blinding a guy for a round or two with a ray that is guaranteed to miss at least 5% of the time sounds like a MUCH better option....

 

[Stone Dog]

Disintigrate allows a save, misses the same 5% you are complaining about and might not do enough damage to hamper the enemy.

Immunity to spells under 5th level only immediately helps you and leaves your allies to fend for themselves.

Running away isn't always an option either. I do hope you were intending on taking the rest of the party with you?

6th level might be a bit much, but the spell hinders the opponent and helps everybody in the fight. That no save bit is pretty huge, remember.

It is an interesting teamwork oriented spell. Now to load a d4.

 

[Thanee]

Nah, blinding a guy for a round or two with a ray that is guaranteed to miss at least 5% of the time sounds like a MUCH better option....

I can think of many situations, where it is, indeed, MUCH better than any of those.

Bye
Thanee

 

[shilsen]

I can think of many situations, where it is, indeed, MUCH better than any of those.

Bye
Thanee

Especially in a team-oriented game such as D&D. Fights against one powerful enemy or a couple of them would go much, much better with this spell.

 

[KarinsDad]

You can't critical with spells that don't deal damage. Complete Arcane, pg. 85-6.

You're right. Wrote that before my morning caffeine.

As a DM, I think the bolded section is a lousy idea. I would instead describe it as the ray hitting the target perfectly and then being deflected away. I don't have the SC so I don't know if that fits the description there, but I prefer my combat descriptions to give players/PCs an idea of what's going on (without spelling it out exactly). Your approach is apparently different.

And how is it different to have this spell protect someone versus Cat's Grace or any other spell that enhances touch armor class?

Would you throw your players a bone when they roll an 18 and miss with a touch attack and it is because the BBEG is displaced or has a high touch AC? What happens when they roll a 4 and miss? Do you still tell them it is deflected away?

Where do you draw the line? As a DM, I think it is a lousy idea to always give your players the answer either directly or indirectly. If they ask what happened, then give them a Spot roll and if they make it, give them a hint. But just spoon feeding them the answer is not a good idea (which your "hitting the target perfectly and then being deflected away" is). How do you know that the Ray is not deflected at the point of origin?

 

[Jhulae]

You're right. Wrote that before my morning caffeine.



And how is it different to have this spell protect someone versus Cat's Grace or any other spell that enhances touch armor class?

Would you throw your players a bone when they roll an 18 and miss with a touch attack and it is because the BBEG is displaced or has a high touch AC? What happens when they roll a 4 and miss? Do you still tell them it is deflected away?

Where do you draw the line? As a DM, I think it is a lousy idea to always give your players the answer either directly or indirectly. If they ask what happened, then give them a Spot roll and if they make it, give them a hint. But just spoon feeding them the answer is not a good idea (which your "hitting the target perfectly and then being deflected away" is). How do you know that the Ray is not deflected at the point of origin?

Well, unless you describe *something*, combats get very boring. "I rolled at 26!" "Miss." Yawn!

Almost every piece of DM advice on how to make the game engaging is to describe what's going on...

 

[RigaMortus2]

Where do you draw the line? As a DM, I think it is a lousy idea to always give your players the answer either directly or indirectly. If they ask what happened, then give them a Spot roll and if they make it, give them a hint. But just spoon feeding them the answer is not a good idea (which your "hitting the target perfectly and then being deflected away" is).

I don't think it is giving anything away. If anything, it is very descriptive and helps draw the players into the game more. Did the spell deflect because of some invisble force protecting the creature? Did it seems like the creature deflected it with his hand? Did it hit him but have no effect? Did he nimbly move out of the way? Did you just totally miss fire and point the ray too far to the left? How is this "spoon feeding"? How is this a "lousy idea"? Seems very engaging to me...

How do you know that the Ray is not deflected at the point of origin?

Precisely! How do you know? It's up to the DM to describe it.

 

[shilsen]

And how is it different to have this spell protect someone versus Cat's Grace or any other spell that enhances touch armor class?

Because apparently this spell deflects rays that hit and spells that enhance touch AC stop (or help to stop) rays from hitting?

Would you throw your players a bone when they roll an 18 and miss with a touch attack and it is because the BBEG is displaced or has a high touch AC?

Absolutely. My description for someone missing a displaced target would be very different from my description for missing a target due to high touch AC. For you that's apparently throwing the players a bone. For me that's giving PCs information that they would see and can act on to try to work out what happened (since I don't spell out what happened but describe it).

What happens when they roll a 4 and miss? Do you still tell them it is deflected away?

No. Because it wasn't deflected away. They missed. So I describe it accordingly.

Where do you draw the line? As a DM, I think it is a lousy idea to always give your players the answer either directly or indirectly. If they ask what happened, then give them a Spot roll and if they make it, give them a hint. But just spoon feeding them the answer is not a good idea (which your "hitting the target perfectly and then being deflected away" is).

I draw the line at not varying my descriptions at all, which is what you suggested one should do for this spell. As Jhulae and RigaMortus2 have pointed out, use of description makes combat more interesting, rewards the PCs for intelligent thought and makes players happy when they eventually work out what's going on. I don't see how any of that is a bad thing.

How do you know that the Ray is not deflected at the point of origin?

As RigaMortus2 said, I don't. So it's up to me to describe it. That's also why I asked how the SC describes it.

 

[Thanee]

Yep, I also try to make descriptions that give hints about the spells/protections in place (if it makes sense to be able to see them work, of course).

Bye
Thanee

 

[Piratecat]

how about Blindness/Deafness, which is PERMANANT and 2nd level? I agree that this Ray of Light spell sounds totally worthless. Or maybe B/D is just way overpowered (what my group thinks)

If your opponent fails his save against blindness/deafness, then 'permanent' is about 1-4 rounds -- just long enough to kill him.

You're paying the big cost in levels for turning it into a ray that gets no save. I'd say for me it's worth it against the right foe.

As a DM, I think it is a lousy idea to always give your players the answer either directly or indirectly. If they ask what happened, then give them a Spot roll and if they make it, give them a hint. But just spoon feeding them the answer is not a good idea (which your "hitting the target perfectly and then being deflected away" is).

It's always interesting discussing things with you, KD, because I suspect that our DMing styles are diametrically opposed. I delight in giving my players hints about what's happening in the environment and letting them deduce effective spell effects and tactics from those. For me, it's a lot more fun to say "Made your spot check? The ray strikes his ear and flashes off at a different angle. That's definitely not usual." After all, it's something their characters would actually see, and (with the right spellcraft check) its something their characters would know. Not giving them information their PCs would have, just because the player didn't specifically call it out, is the type of game I personally wouldn't find fun.

And that, of course, is one of the things that makes this place fun: different people, different styles.