Remember that taking Exotic weapon prof. requires that you have a BAB of at least +1 so you can't take it at 1st lv if you start as a rogue. Start off with Combat Reflexes instead and take EWP at your 1st fighter lv. I recomend being a Dwarf, the 20' move is kind of a pain, but as long as you aren't wearing heavier armor you will stay that fast. Having the reach weapon also kind of negates some of that slow movement. But I think the extra con will be a life saver since you are going to be relying on rogue levels for most of your life. the bonus to save vs spells and poion helps make up for the rogues weak saves. I also think going the strength route could be fun esp if you pick up the Knockdown feat. with a decent strength almost all of your aoo's and attacks will have a chance of knocking a foe to the ground.
Spiked Chain Fighter Rogue advice needed please
- Thread starter Kwyn
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Our DM keeps the copy of S&F (which is why I don't know stats on the Duom) so I'm not sure of what comes into play with Knockdown.
Is it resisted? Is it a strength roll? I'm always leery of contested rolls, because the bad guys often have better stats, at least in strength it seems. In my opininon, a skill has to have a 50% success rate to be something worth planning on reliably.
As far as the levels, since I'm starting at 5, I'll be able to make the change to combat reflexes (or expertise) as a 1st level feat to avoid the EWP problem.
Shallown, thanks for posting the PrC. I'm sure that at some point, someone searching the board for "spiked chain" or "master of chains" will see this thread and reallly be glad they did! For us though, the PrC is a bit overpowered and I'm certain my DM would never allow it. The continuation of good sneak attack progression, along with the improved feint (wow), weapon specialization and super tumble (wow), would in my opinion be better than any prestige class in any of the books. In a high power game however it might fit right in.
One minor point, you indicate that the Black Chains often will "keep the status quo of the city". That's definitely lawful behavior. I might look at making them any non-good rather than any non-lawful. It doesn't seem to be a group that would be interested in following goodly pursuits. If you need to keep them good for some reason, maybe just remove any alignment restriction at all or only make it Lawful Good. Just a suggestion.
Is it resisted? Is it a strength roll? I'm always leery of contested rolls, because the bad guys often have better stats, at least in strength it seems. In my opininon, a skill has to have a 50% success rate to be something worth planning on reliably.
As far as the levels, since I'm starting at 5, I'll be able to make the change to combat reflexes (or expertise) as a 1st level feat to avoid the EWP problem.
Shallown, thanks for posting the PrC. I'm sure that at some point, someone searching the board for "spiked chain" or "master of chains" will see this thread and reallly be glad they did! For us though, the PrC is a bit overpowered and I'm certain my DM would never allow it. The continuation of good sneak attack progression, along with the improved feint (wow), weapon specialization and super tumble (wow), would in my opinion be better than any prestige class in any of the books. In a high power game however it might fit right in.
One minor point, you indicate that the Black Chains often will "keep the status quo of the city". That's definitely lawful behavior. I might look at making them any non-good rather than any non-lawful. It doesn't seem to be a group that would be interested in following goodly pursuits. If you need to keep them good for some reason, maybe just remove any alignment restriction at all or only make it Lawful Good. Just a suggestion.
Kwyn
It is sort of high powered but I compared it to what I could do with keeping a astraight thief and fighter say 12/8 rogue/fighter and with the feats available I came out pretty close to as powerful.
I don't think the improved feint is all that powerful since you are reduced to a single attack anyways. Admittedly no one can beat a bluff very often since sense motive is a rarely used skill.
The weapon specialization still uses a normal feat and isn't extra. and the extended tumble is sweet I Admit. I really strived to stay away from Superntaurl abilities and keep them at best Extra ordinary abilities.
I see your point about the alignment and I could see it going either way. I think it would depend on who defines the Status Quo. If it is the thieves guild then it might not be so lawful. That's the way I see it. But I can see your point.
Thanks for the Comments.
About Knockdown. It is resisted as a normal trip attempt with no return trip allowed. It is basically using the trip mechanic to represent a nasty, hard blow. I ran a short High level dungeo crawl as a "test drive" before I started a new campaign and one character had Knockdown. He always rolled his Knockdown with his to hit to save time. It is a nasty feat. I haven't taken it just so my character wouldn't be too bad a butt kicker. Though I will like at 18th level I think (if I make it there). Forcing people to use a move equivilant to get up and having them prone with a +4 to be hit is nasty.
Later
It is sort of high powered but I compared it to what I could do with keeping a astraight thief and fighter say 12/8 rogue/fighter and with the feats available I came out pretty close to as powerful.
I don't think the improved feint is all that powerful since you are reduced to a single attack anyways. Admittedly no one can beat a bluff very often since sense motive is a rarely used skill.
The weapon specialization still uses a normal feat and isn't extra. and the extended tumble is sweet I Admit. I really strived to stay away from Superntaurl abilities and keep them at best Extra ordinary abilities.
I see your point about the alignment and I could see it going either way. I think it would depend on who defines the Status Quo. If it is the thieves guild then it might not be so lawful. That's the way I see it. But I can see your point.
Thanks for the Comments.
About Knockdown. It is resisted as a normal trip attempt with no return trip allowed. It is basically using the trip mechanic to represent a nasty, hard blow. I ran a short High level dungeo crawl as a "test drive" before I started a new campaign and one character had Knockdown. He always rolled his Knockdown with his to hit to save time. It is a nasty feat. I haven't taken it just so my character wouldn't be too bad a butt kicker. Though I will like at 18th level I think (if I make it there). Forcing people to use a move equivilant to get up and having them prone with a +4 to be hit is nasty.
Later
Thanks again Shallown. Keep in mind that my criticisms come from a background where even making a character who used Spiked Chain will raise eyebrows from the other players. It's a munchkin weapon and is a bit of a reach for us. Your PrC might be perfectly in line with what seems to be the more modern D&D mindset. I just saw the best, most distinctive skills from 3 classes or PrC's in yours and raised *my* eyebrow 
Those being sneak attacks, specialization and improved feint. Not to mention the 30' tumble and the ability to get AOO's on enemy tumblers which normally requires the revised rules from S&F or S&S.
Anyway, thanks.
As to Knockdown, unless I go the strength route, I might need to pass on that. Contested rolls are the bane of my rogues exsitence. As soon as I find the stats on the Duom, I may take a look at that instead of the Chain. Maybe it won't be so goofy looking but will still allow me the neat versatility and combat control that I'm looking for.
Those being sneak attacks, specialization and improved feint. Not to mention the 30' tumble and the ability to get AOO's on enemy tumblers which normally requires the revised rules from S&F or S&S.Anyway, thanks.
As to Knockdown, unless I go the strength route, I might need to pass on that. Contested rolls are the bane of my rogues exsitence. As soon as I find the stats on the Duom, I may take a look at that instead of the Chain. Maybe it won't be so goofy looking but will still allow me the neat versatility and combat control that I'm looking for.
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