Splatbooks to Beware of?
- Thread starter galaga88
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Mouseferatu
Hero
Jdvn1 said:
That explains it. I don't have many of the Forgotten Realms books. I don't think they're necessarily bad or anything (though I have found a higher proportion of broken spells/PrCs in FR books I do own than in the standard D&D line or in Eberron); I just don't play in FR.
From the sound of things, however, no, I wouldn't allow it. (At least, assuming they can do that anytime they want. If they're limited to once or twice a day, I'd certainly consider it.)
It also sounds to me like they're still a lot better than anyone using Divine Metamagic--again, assuming they aren't limited (or are less heavily limited) on daily uses.
Elder-Basilisk
First Post
Persistent Divine Power
Persistent Wraith Strike
Persistent Spell is useless for nine out of ten spells that it would work on and horribly, obscenely broken for the rest. With or without Divine Metamagic, the feat does not belong in the game.
That said, I don't think much of Divine Metamagic or the Sudden feats either. Once (or more with Divine Metamagic) per day perform like a caster four to six levels higher than you is asking to toss game balance out the window. Either you balance for the PCs normal output and get wasted when he turns on the juice or you balance for the x/day output and wax the PCs when they don't figure out which is that one encounter per day that needs all the juice.
Persistent Wraith Strike
Persistent Spell is useless for nine out of ten spells that it would work on and horribly, obscenely broken for the rest. With or without Divine Metamagic, the feat does not belong in the game.
That said, I don't think much of Divine Metamagic or the Sudden feats either. Once (or more with Divine Metamagic) per day perform like a caster four to six levels higher than you is asking to toss game balance out the window. Either you balance for the PCs normal output and get wasted when he turns on the juice or you balance for the x/day output and wax the PCs when they don't figure out which is that one encounter per day that needs all the juice.
Rystil Arden said:
Elder-Basilisk
First Post
Other problematic classes/feats:
1. Radiant Servant of Pelor. I don't think this is as broken as most people claim, but it's definitely front-loaded. Spread the greater turnings out over the ten levels of the class and remove the martial weapon proficiency, and I think it's balanced.
2. Divine Meta-magic has a Holy Word/Blasphemy/etc problem. Really, however, it's the Holy Word spell and its look alikes that are the problem more than Divine metamagic (which is still a strong feat without the combo). The broken combos discussed above are easily doable without Divine Metamagic--just the alignment domain, ring, and orange prism ioun stone will boost caster level to +3, the karma bead will get +7, and death knell will make it +8. Not instakill with no save perhaps, but stunning or paralyzing with no save is a pretty good second best.
It's also worse in the hands of NPCs than PCs since the PCs foes often have more HD than their CR (frequently double their CR in HD) but PCs almost always have their level for HD.
3. The skilled and magebane weapon enhancements are pretty heinous too. A +2 enhancement that gives you BAB=HD?!? Why play a fighter again? Bane: everything with spell like abilities or spells? Oh, you mean bane just about everything high level PCs fight.
4. Mage Slayer and the other feats in that chain from Complete Arcane are better than epic feats like Spellcasting Harrier.
5. Fatespinner is problematic not because of the spin fate abilities which I haven't seen make a huge difference, but rather because of the nearly non-existent prereqs and the ability to get a 1/day re-roll. Nearly every arcane power-build now includes at least two levels of fatespinner because you can get that huge bonus (very important at high levels because of the frequency of saves) at nearly no cost. Tack on a few prerequisites that actually present an opportunity cost (like Skill Focus: Profession Gambler or even just 10 ranks of Profession: Gambler), and it would be a lot more balanced.
1. Radiant Servant of Pelor. I don't think this is as broken as most people claim, but it's definitely front-loaded. Spread the greater turnings out over the ten levels of the class and remove the martial weapon proficiency, and I think it's balanced.
2. Divine Meta-magic has a Holy Word/Blasphemy/etc problem. Really, however, it's the Holy Word spell and its look alikes that are the problem more than Divine metamagic (which is still a strong feat without the combo). The broken combos discussed above are easily doable without Divine Metamagic--just the alignment domain, ring, and orange prism ioun stone will boost caster level to +3, the karma bead will get +7, and death knell will make it +8. Not instakill with no save perhaps, but stunning or paralyzing with no save is a pretty good second best.
It's also worse in the hands of NPCs than PCs since the PCs foes often have more HD than their CR (frequently double their CR in HD) but PCs almost always have their level for HD.
3. The skilled and magebane weapon enhancements are pretty heinous too. A +2 enhancement that gives you BAB=HD?!? Why play a fighter again? Bane: everything with spell like abilities or spells? Oh, you mean bane just about everything high level PCs fight.
4. Mage Slayer and the other feats in that chain from Complete Arcane are better than epic feats like Spellcasting Harrier.
5. Fatespinner is problematic not because of the spin fate abilities which I haven't seen make a huge difference, but rather because of the nearly non-existent prereqs and the ability to get a 1/day re-roll. Nearly every arcane power-build now includes at least two levels of fatespinner because you can get that huge bonus (very important at high levels because of the frequency of saves) at nearly no cost. Tack on a few prerequisites that actually present an opportunity cost (like Skill Focus: Profession Gambler or even just 10 ranks of Profession: Gambler), and it would be a lot more balanced.
gtJormungand
First Post
Elder-Basilisk said:
Which book is the skill enhancement in?
Liquidsabre
Explorer
Mouseferatu said:
Actually, our game group has found more problems with using the splat books than the FR books - everything from editing problems to balance problems. Not that FR doesn't have it's own bits to look out for of course, there just aren't as many of them is all. Perhaps they have more people working on them, including editors. The level of quality of the FR game material is really the only reason I picked up and enjoy using the setting in the first place. Don't have to constantly search for errata all the time either.
Patryn of Elvenshae
First Post
A book of options, generally aimed at players of particular races or character classes.
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